King springs versus stock springs

[amichie]

A bit of an update.

I pulled one of the front struts out today and checked the setting on the koni shock and compared the two sets of king springs I have.

1. The Koni was set to about 60% of full. It was set to about 1.5 turns off minimum and the total number of turns is about 2.25. I also confirmed that it only affects the rebound stroke and not the bump stroke. I don't know what colour koni it is because I didn't remove it from the strut housing.

2. Both king springs were approximately the same stiffness although they were a little different in design. 0ne was made from 14 mm wire with about 4 3/4 turns the other was made from 15mm wire with about 5 3/4 turns and according to my calculations they are both around 160lb/inch and I'm pretty sure they are uprated by about 30-35% over stock. I believe the stock spring are made from 13.5 mm wire but I don't know how many turns until I get my hands on a set.


Also ball joints are bolted in and absolutely no sign of rust near the ball joint or cracking in the body.

[colcol]

The longer/stiffer spring will be for the drivers side, so when the driver is in the car, the car will be on the level as opposed to being on the piss.
The orange Koni is the standardish one, the yellow ones are sport.
To remove the shocker from the housing, loosen off the bolt at the bottom of the housing and give it a tap with a mallet, to  move the insert upwards, so you can see what color it is, if possible, put a longer bolt in the bottom, so you are using all the thread and you don't damage the thread.
The ball joints being bolted in means that they have been replaced at some stage which is good.
You can actually get the springs re-heat treated to be made softer, but now that spring wizard Lloyd Moss is no longer around, i don't know who could do it, Colin.

[amichie]

Finally found a pic of a stock front spring online.

[Sportscar Nut]

Pending your budget, I would replace all bushes and have the Koni's serviced. There is a big difference between reds & yellows as reds are close to original in stiffness whilst yellows are noticeably harder and change some of the original compliant setting.

Not sure a 2 inch exhaust system will add a lot of power but the standard middle & rear exhausts rob circa 5hp ATW's so is a cheap hp gain to get the car breathing better. Bigger air intakes also make a big difference.

Would be great to see the car at Spetacollo!

Paul

[colcol]

I remember about 25 years ago they were making engine pipes for Suds and 33's that were timed properly, so that the pipes fed into the middle section with the correct timing, so that it scavenged the exhaust gases better.
Problems included, less ground clearance for pipes and the pipes would overheat the oil in the gearbox.
Also quite expensive to make as the pipes were all the same length and crossed over each other.
I think it was made by ANSA or someone,
The 1700 cc have bigger pipes than the 1500 coming out of the head in a 33.
One of the problems with fitting 1700 motors in the Sud from a 33, you have to fit the standard 1500 Sud engine pipes, Colin.

[amichie]

I don't know why I didn't think of this before but I did some measurements of the installed height of the springs today and compared it with the 86 sprint that has outboard brakes and drums on the rear.

Front lowered kings installed height about 140mm versus stock sprint at 175mm.

Rear lowered kings approx 210mm versus stock sprint rears at 240mm.

Looks like if I use the springs from the Sprint it will raise the car about 30 to 40mm all round and give me back my ride quality.
I might start pulling the Sprints Springs out this weekend.

[colcol]

Alfasud twin carb 1983 model is different to a 1986 Sprint, as the Sprint is based on the 33, the control arms and pickup points are different, but the springs may interchange.
We tried an experiment a few years ago, trying to fit 1985 33 suspension to a 1980 Alfasud, and while it all looked the same, things were different and nothing fitted properly, Colin.

[amichie]

I just started an introduction thread with some pics of the car. In the pics of the Alfasud TI it has standard King Spring lows in the rear and custom made king spring lows that are set 40mm lower than the standard lows. Given that standard lows are about 35mm lower tan stock springs that makes the fronts about 75mm lower.

http://www.alfaclubvic.org.au/forum/index.php/topic,13509.0.html

[amichie]

Bit of an update.

A few weeks back I had the passenger side front strut out and found it had what looked like a Koni Red shock insert and confirmed that you could push the strut all the way in and adjust the damping.

Today I pulled the drivers side apart and found it also had a red strut insert but this one is gas pressurised and is very difficult to compress fully.

I'm not sure what's going on here. I searched online a couldn't really confirm if the koni reds are gas pressurised or not. I guess I either have one worn out shock that has lost all its gas or I have two different shocks.

Both struts have the retaining bolts at the bottom of the strut, so I believe they have both had replacement inserts fitted at some point. The strut housings are original Alfa Spica units.

[colcol]

You might have a 'standard' road going KONI that has been rebuilt to race specifications, and it is on maximum stiffness and is hard to compress to engage the tang in the bottom of the KONI to adjust the settings.
If i remember rightly, you pushdown on the inner moveable tube and engage the tang anti clockwise for soft settings and clockwise to harden it up.
Or as KOMI once said, you adjust it clockwise to take up any wear, Colin.

[amichie]

I had no issues adjusting the passenger side one using the standard practice of pushing it all the way down, engaging the teeth and turning the rod, and there was absolutely no gas pressure pushing the piston rod out. In fact it would go back in very slowly under its own weight when held vertically.
The drivers side one has lots of pressure like a Bilstein and is virtually impossible to fully compress. I will try and knock out the insert tomorrow and see if I can see some part numbers. I'm now thinking I have one healthy one and one that's lost its gas.

[amichie]

OK. I decided that the issue with the strut inserts would have to wait for another day and I decided to put the struts back together using the stock springs from the Sprint.

Good news is that I have about 35mm of ride height back and now my steering is much lighter and the ride and handling is improved markedly. Stiff low springs at the front just caused understeer, heavy steering and a crappy ride.

I will post some pics etc later. Massive storm coming over here right now so the car is back in the garage.

I have made some pretty comprehensive measurements of the springs and calculated spring rates that I will post up later also.

[amichie]

In the pic below the springs from right to left are.
1. Stock Alfasud spring. Not sure what series or year.
2. King spring low part no KAFL-01. Supposedly 35mm lower than stock.
3. Stock 1986 Alfa sprint front spring.

Calculated installed spring rates from coil dimensions.

1. 115 pounds per inch free length 360mm
2. 161 pounds per inch free length 300mm
3. 139 pounds per inch free length 310mm

[amichie]

Now for the rear

In the pic below from right to left

1.Stock 1986 Alfa sprint rear spring.
2. A custom made King spring low set 30mm lower that the stock lowered spring resulting in a spring that is about 65mm lower than stock.

Calculated spring rates

1. 122 Pounds per inch free length 317mm
2. 135 Pounds per inch fre length 285mm