Aftermarket fuel injection on Alfetta Gtv 2Lt engine - Sensors

[Alfetta77]

Hi, I have a 1977 Alfetta GTV that came with an aftermarket efi system (wolf 3D v4, custom plenum, fuel rail, electric pump, sensors, etc). I am taking the efi system off the car to run carbies as there is no way the current system will make it through a roadworthy. I have a spare engine though so interested in tinkering with the efi system on this. To get to the point, if I want to run individual throttle bodies as compared to a plenum with a pod filter, what sensors will be needed? Also do I need a camshaft position sensor as well as a crankshaft sensor? Any thoughts appreciated 

[Citroënbender]

What would make it unpassable on a Vic RWC?

Surely you could sort it to be VASS compliant with less cost/grief than dialling in a set of carbies.

[Alfetta77]

Thanks Citroenbender, fair question. The fuel pump, surge tank, filter had been mounted on the boot floor, an in tank set up would have been better for RWC.

The other issue, not related to RWC, was that a plenum had been used instead of individual throttle bodies (ITB's) as the previous owner had run a supercharger for a while. The plenum was pretty rough, plus I like the look and sound of ITB's.

The ecu and loom were ok, but I worked out to replace the plenum with ITB's and purchase an in-tank pump etc would have been about $2K, as compared to $500 for a carb rebuild. It has been a lot of stuffing around though, you are right about that!

[Duk]

Hi, I have a 1977 Alfetta GTV that came with an aftermarket efi system (wolf 3D v4, custom plenum, fuel rail, electric pump, sensors, etc). I am taking the efi system off the car to run carbies as there is no way the current system will make it through a roadworthy. I have a spare engine though so interested in tinkering with the efi system on this. To get to the point, if I want to run individual throttle bodies as compared to a plenum with a pod filter, what sensors will be needed? Also do I need a camshaft position sensor as well as a crankshaft sensor? Any thoughts appreciated 

From the information and multiple forum posts out there, getting most a typical programmable computer to run well with ITB is a big task. The MAP sensor vacuum signal is often very weak and causes a large loss in resolution and unfortunately the fix is more involved than just T-ing all of the ports together.
Car manufacturers stayed well clear of ITB on even their most powerful NA cars that are out there.
Porsches current 911GT3 is a classic example, 125hp/litre.
And when car manufacturers did use ITB, they almost always used an air flow meter. The last of the Toyota 20 valve 4AGE's was a notable exception, as it was MAP sensed.
Look to see if the Wolf can be setup to run with the Throttle Position Sensor as the primary load input, but use the MAP sensor as an atmospheric pressure compensating input with a tunable map to suit.

As for a crank angle sensor and camshaft sensor.
If you want to run the engine in full sequential injection, then the ECU needs to know where the engine is in its full 720* cycle.
That is often done with a CAS and a camshaft speed triggered reset. There is more than 1 way to skin a cat tho.
If you don't need or want to go full sequential injection and just use paired injector/semi-sequential, then a conventional CAS by itself is all you need.
Use as many trigger edges as you can to help the ECU keep track of engine position. The Bosch 60-2 is a good example of this, but the Ford 36-1 would also work well and can be used with a Hall Effect sensor, where the 60-2 wheel has too many trigger edges for most HE sensors to work with as engine speed gets higher.
That sort of thing can also be done via a camshaft speed sensor and you could look at using a well designed camshaft speed sensor from another car and adapting it to the Alfa's distributor or inplace of the distributor. But that will depend on your access to getting stuff machined accurately. The Nissan CA18 CAS would be a good choice.

[Alfetta77]

That's brilliant Duk. I had read something about sequential fuel injection necessitating a camshaft sensor, but you have explained much more clearly. Good advice re TPOS as primary input too. Many thanks 

[carlo rossi]

i would dyno it first to get a base line
and again when you put carbs on using same dyno
they all read different

[Alfetta77]

Thanks for replies everyone, I now have the answers I need.

[Storm_X]

Are you interested in selling the fuel injection setup at all ¿

[Alfetta77]

Hi Storm, yes.

I have sold the ecu but still have:

Custom plenum with throttle body and position sensor
Bosch fuel pump
Bosch fuel filter
Coil packs with leads
Bosch fuel injectors
Fuel rail
Sard regulator
Camshaft and crankshaft position sensors
Air and water temp sensors

Let me know if you are interested and I can PM some photos.

Thanks, Mark

[Storm_X]

Hi Storm, yes.

I have sold the ecu but still have:

Custom plenum with throttle body and position sensor
Bosch fuel pump
Bosch fuel filter
Coil packs with leads
Bosch fuel injectors
Fuel rail
Sard regulator
Camshaft and crankshaft position sensors
Air and water temp sensors

Let me know if you are interested and I can PM some photos.

Thanks, Mark

Pm sent

[aflp]

vehicles manufactured after 1 July 1976 –

The vehicles that are the subject of this guideline are
primarily those constructed with emission controls – in
other words, vehicles manufactured after 1 July 1976 –
although some general requirements (for example,
noise) will apply to all vehicles.
The Environment Protection Act 1970 (the Act) requires
various parties – including designers, manufacturers,
sellers, owners and drivers – to do or not do certain
things with respect to air and noise emissions from
motor vehicles. These requirements are spelt out in
more detail in the Environment Protection (Vehicle
Emissions) Regulations 2003 (the Regulations). Both
the Act and the Regulations state that anyone who fails
to comply with a requirement is guilty of an offence and
liable to a penalty, with the maximum penalty for the
most serious offences being 2400 penalty units.

https://www.epa.vic.gov.au/~/media/Publications/1031%204.pdf