Entering a world of pain - restoring my 1984 GTV 2.0

[MattK]

So - I've owned this car for 12 years but it's been off the road for 4 ... a friend borrowed it and broke something in the gearbox (I think, can't recall). Anyway it has been sitting outside, unloved, and it's reached the point where I either need to fix it up or move it on, otherwise there won't be a car to make a decision about any more.
Engine is basically sound, gearbox needs a fix, and the plan is to find a good painter to do it from bare metal. Unsure whether to take out the engine, finding storage would be a challenge and the paint inside the engine bay is fine.
Obviously I need to cut and replace the mud trap on the right front wing, otherwise just a few little crunches at the headlight margins and one on the rear.
I've never done anything remotely like this before. Got a mate who is an experienced Alfa mechanic but would appreciate any advice and insights. I'm not a huge fan of red cars but for simplicity's sake and historical correctness I plan to keep it in factory colours (including the 1984-only "gunmetal lower body" look).
Engine will need new fuel hoses and all that stuff - any tasteful upgrades / fixes I should be looking at? Was considering one of the electronic ignition kits I saw on the Highwood Alfa website.

[rowan_bris]

It should already have an electronic ignition.

[MattK]

Duh, as soon as I read that I thought oh yeah, it does!

[Paul Gulliver]

I think you first of all need to establish a budget and work out  what you want from the  car . Is it going to be a daily driver again , a weekend car or something better than that.  If it is going to be anything other than the later. I would be concentrating on getting the mechanicals working so it is drivable /  possibly saleable .

Not wanting to hurt anyone's feeling but on the strength of a few photo's and none of the interior the car is hard to establish its worth , but let's say  probably > $10,000. If your not handy and your mate doesn't work for nothing it would be easy enough to spend $5 k getting it going and registered . Paint is going to cost anywhere from $3 K to $30 K depending on what you ask and what you want to hear. Would it then be worth < $20,000. I'm not so sure. There may well be some sentimental value we don't know about.  Very easy to get carried away with the romance of fixing an old car but if you don't have the skills and only the chequebook you would be better off quitting early sell the car and buy someone's else's efforts  who has already been through the process.    Just an opinion.

PS : As for" a world of pain", I remember once asking  my wife what she wanted for her birthday . Her response was, Spend  till it hurts . Know what you are getting yourself in for.
PPS : As it happens I have a very low pain threshold on those sorts of things.

[Citroënbender]

Along the lines of prior comment, the question to be most bluntly asked is "Would you spend $30000 on yourself in the next two years otherwise?".

I'm fairly anti-car show these days, not to eschew the restoration process but greatly emphasise the idea of car pleasure coming from using it, not showing it to people. For this reason I will generally advocate working out whether you're prepared to invest the time and money in making something to own, to use and enjoy.

If you did restore the car, would you add a new shed or garage to keep it in? Should a $35K structure be your actual first priority?

Overlooked in many restoration projects is proper planning, this can involve gophering, lots of test fitting, detailed cleaning and refurbishment of subassemblies, standing your ground when rework or further refinements are needed, and multilingual resourcing. And above all, making sure works are sequenced correctly.

[Craig_m67]

"Been sitting outside for four years"
"Finding storage would be a challenge"


Okay.....
1. Get a set of jumper leads and see if you can get the engine running (after cursory checks for oil, water, fuel, brakes, etc)
2. When you can't, check the body carefully for signs of rust. They rust from the inside out. Any little bubbling on the surface denotes and iceberg of corrosion inside.
3. After identifying all the rust, walk away and buy your wife/GF something amazing.
4. Reconsider budget, love, sentimental value of above car


Was this chassis Galvanised, I thought the late ones were, in which case it might not be as bad as it could/will be??

[MattK]

Thanks for your blunt assessments - these things are easy to get carried away with, I know!
Before it went off the road it was running OK, but had a lot of niggles like a weak alternator, starter motor sticking, etc. It had also had an engine "overhaul" (incl cylinder hone, rings etc) which I put in quotes because I moved interstate before the job was finished, when I got it from the shipping company the valve clearances were all over the shop. That got partially remedied but it was never quite up to snuff. Then it was stolen, which involved the driver's door lock being broken and the steering column being broken as well (to get at the ignition). With the paint faded and many other things going on, it was easier to let it sit. And then my (Alfa experienced) friend borrowed it because he didn't have a car, drove it for a couple of months and then something went in the gearbox, I don't recall at the moment.
So basically the engine has a decent bottom end, the clearances need to be done properly, the gearbox is great and smooth apart from the broken element (which my friend will make good) and it needs the steering column replaced properly. However it drove well and was a blast to drive, it just looked sad and wasn't the most reliable.
So my thinking is, friend and I will strip the interior (mostly good except maybe the door cards) and the glass (call a windscreen place to get the windscreen removed?), I'll get a replacement driver's side mudtrap panel welded in and the corners beside the headlights straightened, and get it in for paint - I'm guessing a decent job will be around $8k. Only other rust spot on the body is the tailgate below the rear windshield in one corner. I don't know if it's galvanised but that level of rust suggests it might be. Interior is in good condition albeit a little faded - don't think it needs replacing.
As for having a place to garage it, I have a few options and will also invest in a decent car cover if it needs to be outside for a bit. I'd be happy to daily drive it I think.
I'm guessing it'd be worth $12-15k in good condition, and I bought it for $3.5k so I'm thinking $10k to bring it back is not unreasonable. I've owned Alfas for 20 years so I know at least some of what I'm in for, I've just never had a car painted before. My own ability tops out at stuff like replacing cam cover gaskets and alternators, replacing a crank sensor, that kind of stuff. And I know my way around wiring.

[As the day goes]

I have seen those cars where the while hatch thing is rusting.   I doubt with a full strip you are going to spend less than $50,000. You may save some money if you are wanting to sand it back yourself. My 2c

[Craig_m67]

For what it's worth - I should have added some smiley faces
I say go for it if you want (most restored Alfas were basket cases once, the rest are lipstick pigs or Unicorns)

Just be aware that there WILL be rust that you can't see and it will be expensive to repair correctly
ie.. repaired so it doesn't return to bubble under your shiny new paint (see Cherry, my GTJunior)

[poohbah]

My own story of pain - I bought my GTV for $4k three years ago. Like yours, a long list of mechanical work had supposedly been done, so I was thinking for another $5k to spruce up the body (which was straight, fairly rust free but just needing a refresher) I would have a pretty flash ride.

Three years later, the bodywork is still on the list of things to do as I've had to spend a lot more than the purchase price on mechanical work including overhauling the gearbox (I'm not skilled enough to do more than pretty basic stuff).

But it is now a bloody good driver and fantastic fun, and I can't imagine getting rid of it. Eventually I'll get around to the paint (and a few other things). Luckily prices are on the rise so I think I bought at the bottom.

So as others have suggested - start with getting it roadworthy first, and then you can at least enjoy it while you plan out future work campaigns.

[As the day goes]

Ohh and have talk to these guys:

http://www.extremebodyrepairs.com.au/m/classic.html

[poohbah]

Being a GTV owner, that's a scary pic of the inside rear quarter, Oz...

[MattK]

I doubt with a full strip you are going to spend less than $50,000.

FIFTY GRAND for paint? Does anyone else concur? I am planning to get some quotes and if it's over ten I will sell the car, I like it a lot but I'm not an idiot.

[poohbah]

Entirely depends on how much metalwork/fabrication is needed. Have a poke around and get a feel for how much rot there is - sills, inside rear quarter panels, rear hatch, roof (if you have a sunroof), inside front quarters.

[rowan_bris]

I don't concur with $50,000 for a respray, rather than a full restoration which obviously wouldn't be justified given the end value.  You might easily spend $10,000 painting it with a bit of rust, and assuming you strip and reassemble it.  Given the prices of a few (rare) very good ones for sale recently, I wouln't personally think it was worth spending that on it, but each to their own.