New to 105's

[Walker]

Hi all,
        I am very new to the Alfa 105 series but I am looking at buying a 2000GTV. I will be buying it mostly as a restoration (maybe modification) project.

I am sure this question has been asked many times, but are there any inherint problems I should be looking out for when I buy one? Obviously as a project vehicle I will be doing some work on it, but I am sure that there are some Alfa parts that are hard to get or more expensive than others.

I mostly ask this question because I might have the opportunity to buy one soon but it seems very cheap for a driveable vehicle (under $7k) so I thought I better find out a bit more about the model before I make a decision.

thanks

[Davidm1600]

Hi Walker and welcome. I hope the car you are after works out just fine.  I have had a 1750 series 1 since '97 and up until last year used it as my daily driver. The poor old thing is now tired, though has a new engine, with rust in all the usual places, crappy paint (due to poor repairs and living outdoors for so long, let alone a tired interior.  Having said that it has been extremely reliable and given me heaps of pleasure.  You do need to consider the cars abilities, however, in terms of the period it was designed and made. Even a 2000 GTV is now around 32-35 years old.  Its not like driving a modern car.  I am also restoring a 105 '69 Giulia Super (Sedan).

Ok as to your queries.  re the price of the car you are looking at, that should get you a useable car, that may need work but perhaps something that can be done as a rolling restoration rather than a total one at once, unless you have deep pockets, time and another car to use for the daily.

There was a metallic dark green '73 2000GTV on ebay which supposedly apart from some "minor" rust was ok, it went for approx $6100 ?  In the pictures it looked good, so long as you could live with the non-original colour.  However, at the other end of the spectrum, I have seen fully restored 2000GTVs going for $30K +

In terms of things to look for, the key is probably rust.  105 coupes rust in many places, including the cills, bottom of doors, around the door handle, around the front and rear windows in bad examples, rear wheel arches, at the bottom of the rear guards, the rear valance, the bootlid, spare wheel well, bottom of front guards, front sway bar mountings, as well as inside including the front and rear floors in the corners and even next to the transmission tunnel. If I have forgotten anything I am sure others will mention these. 

Mechanically, the engine is extremely tough and long living so long as it has been properely maintained. However, head gasket problems are not uncommon, also rings/bearings, valve stem seals, timing chain problems (eg slack and rattling).  The suspension both front and rear can be very tired, eg. worn/squeaky bushes, tierods and ball joints.  Also check the shocks.  Gearbox synchro problems, especially between 1st and 2nd and sometimes 3rd is not uncommon, ditto problems with reverse jumping out of gear.   I recently had my gearbox for my Giulia Super fully rebuilt for $1100 and that was for the parts.  labour was a decent bottle of red (a mate, who was studying at TAFE) did it for me a a project, under supervision.  Brakes can be sticky (usually the calipers), and I have in the past had trouble with the servos, mastercylinders, slave cylinders etc. These can be rebuilt with a kit or purchase a new one.  Generally the carbs (Twin 40 Dellortos on most 2000GTVs) are fine.  Many 2L 105 Alfas came with a LSD.  These can fail.

Electrics can also be a problem, including the headlight stalk for low/high beam, seats and carpets can wear badly.  The internal woodwork can fade and/or warp with age, ditto cracks in the dashboard.

Also look for signs of poor panel repair due to accidents, 105s are especially soft in the rear end, look for creases over the rear arch, but also look under the front guards and inside the engine bay for any signs of damage. A good sign is if the side crease line is fine, and the panel gaps even.  Tap the body for signs of filler (eg. a dull thud sound).

The majority of trim on 105s is stainless steel, which is good since (a) it doesn't rust and (b) minor damage and/or dullness can readily be repaired.

Ok that hopefully gives you a quick idea of the sorts of problems that can occur.  Obviously not all cars will have such problems.  The best thing you can do is get it checked out by someone (mechanics) who know Alfas and especially the older models.  I am not so sure whether the dealers these days are all that interested or knowledgeable, but there are many specialists.  Also talk to someone in the AROCA in your State, only Tassie (where I live) and I think the NT don't have a club. All clubs have a website, see this forum for links or Google it.

Lastly, both this forum and the Alfabb (bulletin board) are excellent sources of contacts, and resources, let alone information and pictures of GTV restorations.  The BB is an international site and extremely addictive.

Yes Alfa parts can be expensive, however, there are a variety of sources for parts to assist you for virtually anything you may need.  These include here in Aus, Milano Spares, and the 105 Factory in Melbourne, also Pace Engineering (Vin Sharp) for engineering/performance parts/rebuilds etc.  They are all in the Vic Club and Vin certainly posts on both forums. 

Overseas in the UK, Classic Alfa (Richard Norris) and Alfaholics are probably the best source for all your parts.  Max and Richard Banks (Alfaholics) are undoubtedly the best to talk to about performance/race enhancements.  See their websites.  Also in the UK there is the Highwood Motor Company (Chris Applewood ??) and EB Spares. In addition to this there are a variety of 105 sites in Holland, the US etc.  Lastly Ebay (both here in Aus and overseas) is an excellent source for parts and sometimes you may get a bargain.

While Alfa parts may seem a little expensive, I think in truth they are probaly no worse than many other imported cars, irrespective of where they come from, and the Alfa virus is totally addictive. I speak from 25 years experience in owning/driving Alfas.  I am definitely an Alfaholic !!

Is the price you mention (under $7k) too cheap, well it depends on the condition/history of the car, how much work it may require and alternatively if you can buy a better one or not (how deep is your wallet).  You may, however, be lucky and have found a bargain.  It can happen.

Hope the above helps you, for a good one is a classic sportscar and great fun to drive and own.

Cheers Dave

[Walker]

Fantastic David, thankyou.

This will be an "extra" car for the time being so I will be able to have it off the road while I restore it. Once it is all finished then my wife will use it as a daily driver and I will get it weekends, she only does about 20km/week so it should be perfect.
I just have to finish my current project (hopefully by the end of this year) then I can seriously start on the Alfa.

[Tim Jobson]

Good summary of exactlty what I have experienced to dated with my car Dave, I am just hoping the dollar will creep a little higher to help source parts.

Cheers Tim

[Davidm1600]

Hi Walker

Sounds good and I am glad I didn't put you off.  Hope you can post some pictures of the car when you get it.   Have fun with the project as a nice 105 GTV is a real pleasure.

Tim yes I know exactly what you mean.  Damn it all there is still quite a few parts I still need to finish off the Super, let alone commence on the 1750 resto.  Oh well, will just have to save up for it and hope the dollar recovers against the UK pound so that I too can continue with the parts sourcing. Cheers Dave