105 restoration - definitely not a rally car

[Colin Byrne]

So we managed to get from Targa High country pretty much un scathed, (the old man's car, well that's a different story) we also managed to retain our Crown with back to back wins!.
As we're not doing Targa Tassie next year I'm having a bit of a break from the rally car and though I'd start restoring my old 2L road car.  I have the car for a while now, it was my daily driver for a bit, it's very original and hasn't been interfered with much.  The plan is to do it up pretty standard, maybe a couple of Mod Cons hidden away, and probably throw a few go faster parts that have been shed by the other car, but it's definitely not going to be another rally car.!!!
I 'll try and update via youtube

https://youtu.be/66qW1TOX_i0

[Citroënbender]

Will you be able to resist temptation and avoid scope creep? 

Beaut smooth technique on the TIG; I'm a sufficiently bad welder to admire the abilities of those who do it so well.

[Colin Byrne]

Haha, probably not, the battle between good and evel rages on, i'll definitely need the support of the forum to stay away from the dark side!

One thing I that is keeping me up at night is the braking system, well the master cylinder side anyway.  I really can't stand the twin remote booster setup, I don't like remote boosters on principle, I think they look awful in the he engine bay, and the 5 billion brake lines running around the firewall are a totall mess.  I guess on a left hand drive it was much neater, so would be getting rid of them be real no-no on an otherwise original car?

Thanks for the welding comments, a lot of practice there welding spaceframs roll cages and extractors..... so many extractors

[aggie57]

I guess the obvious question re. the brakes Colin is how to engineer a twin circuit system with the carbs right where the booster would go on a typical pedal box. Any ideas?

[Citroënbender]

A 147/156 type pedal box is surely one starting point, and not expensive or rare. Take the whole firewall plate as a headstart.

[Craig_m67]

I guess the obvious question re. the brakes Colin is how to engineer a twin circuit system with the carbs right where the booster would go on a typical pedal box. Any ideas?

Could the pedal box, thick brake bar and booster from a 116 car be utilised somehow?
(Always looked like a bodge to me, but you might as well follow the factory's development footsteps)

[rowan_bris]

It works - that is by far the most common conversion method used, it just doesn't look although neat!

[aggie57]

Yes, that's the most common method per LHD to RHD conversions but I agree it looks and really is a bit of an average solution.

I'm thinking Colin with all his experience fabricating solutions for his rally car may have some still-secret thoughts on a more elegant approach.

Full disclosure as well, my also-Le Mans blue GTV is about to hit the paint shop and even though I've spent $ on some new boosters and have fabricated new pipes etc., I could be tempted by a more modern and better thought out alternative.

[Citroënbender]

Any chance of a RHD firewall photo?

[bonno]

In regards to brake booster options, a remote mounted brake booster could be located underbody/boot. See attached diagram of simple brake circuit.

[aggie57]

For compliance and safety reasons you need a dual circuit master. Which is why we have two boosters in these cars, there's nowhere to place a single booster upstream of the master like in most cars.

[LaStregaNera]

Haha, probably not, the battle between good and evel rages on, i'll definitely need the support of the forum to stay away from the dark side!

One thing I that is keeping me up at night is the braking system, well the master cylinder side anyway.  I really can't stand the twin remote booster setup, I don't like remote boosters on principle, I think they look awful in the he engine bay, and the 5 billion brake lines running around the firewall are a totall mess.  I guess on a left hand drive it was much neater, so would be getting rid of them be real no-no on an otherwise original car?

Thanks for the welding comments, a lot of practice there welding spaceframs roll cages and extractors..... so many extractors

I designed an built a bracket and pushrod to use a more easily available tandem master (that happens to come in the right size for eliminating the boosters) in the stock position. I've been running my install for 6 years now, Sketchl is running one of my kits on his GTA rep. Tidies the engine bay up very nicely, gives excellent pedal feel with the 2l brakes I'm running. I think Pancho *might* get his GTV with this setup on it on the road in 2019, and looking at putting one into Derek's Giulia Super in the next couple of months...

[Craig_m67]

Haha, probably not, the battle between good and evel rages on, i'll definitely need the support of the forum to stay away from the dark side!

One thing I that is keeping me up at night is the braking system, well the master cylinder side anyway.  I really can't stand the twin remote booster setup, I don't like remote boosters on principle, I think they look awful in the he engine bay, and the 5 billion brake lines running around the firewall are a totall mess.  I guess on a left hand drive it was much neater, so would be getting rid of them be real no-no on an otherwise original car?

Thanks for the welding comments, a lot of practice there welding spaceframs roll cages and extractors..... so many extractors

I designed an built a bracket and pushrod to use a more easily available tandem master (that happens to come in the right size for eliminating the boosters) in the stock position. I've been running my install for 6 years now, Sketchl is running one of my kits on his GTA rep. Tidies the engine bay up very nicely, gives excellent pedal feel with the 2l brakes I'm running. I think Pancho *might* get his GTV with this setup on it on the road in 2019, and looking at putting one into Derek's Giulia Super in the next couple of months...

Talk to me.. pics, details - Merry Christmas!

[LaStregaNera]

This is a pic from before I had the custom pushrod ends made, they're now a zinc plated piece that seals the master cylinder boot. The crappy spring is no longer there, and a pedal stop that mirrors the clutch pedal stop on the cable clutch cars is now used. Really must shoot some updated photos.
There's a built in circuit failure switch, I don't have a light on the dash to connect it to, but the dual circuit cars did I believe (incidentally, the shuttle valve that triggers the switch can cause problems when bleeding the system up from dry - if you make full pressure in one circuit with air in the other it will lock over and prevent the empty circuit from being bled up).
Twin reservoirs in the back corner of the engine bay was what I wound up with.
I'm currently trying to find the time to rework the design as a CNC'd alloy mounting piece rather than the laser cut and tig welded bracket that the first batch was done as. I've also been trying to find a LHD pedal box/master mounting to investigate fitment to LHD single circuit cars.

[aggie57]

This is a pic from before I had the custom pushrod ends made, they're now a zinc plated piece that seals the master cylinder boot. The crappy spring is no longer there, and a pedal stop that mirrors the clutch pedal stop on the cable clutch cars is now used. Really must shoot some updated photos.
There's a built in circuit failure switch, I don't have a light on the dash to connect it to, but the dual circuit cars did I believe (incidentally, the shuttle valve that triggers the switch can cause problems when bleeding the system up from dry - if you make full pressure in one circuit with air in the other it will lock over and prevent the empty circuit from being bled up).
Twin reservoirs in the back corner of the engine bay was what I wound up with.
I'm currently trying to find the time to rework the design as a CNC'd alloy mounting piece rather than the laser cut and tig welded bracket that the first batch was done as. I've also been trying to find a LHD pedal box/master mounting to investigate fitment to LHD single circuit cars.

Definitely interested!  From the pictures it looks like the master bolts up to the standard holes and uses the standard pedals?  With the bracket you designed?