156 questions & queries!

[hughstephens]

Hey all
I'm a newbie to both AROC and alfa's in general.
I'm actually only 18 as well and I'm looking at buying a 156 (twin man - not selespeed) as essentially a first car. In the past I've driven a 92 mazda 323 (which as of now has 43000k's on it...i was amazed),  as well as an 07 yaris and a mid-late bmw 323ci. All nice cars and that, but I'm obviously looking for something more in the bmw end of the spectrum...love the handling. not to mention leather seats
Anyway. So I've been watching the used cars for a while now...I particularly want one with the sunroof (which was an option..damn).

The kinds of issues I wanted to look at were as follows - I've referenced to anything I've read here or elsewhere.

1. I tried to see if I could get a copy of the article mentioned in the forum about the Auto Italia article, but I don't have a copy, and i cant get one . Anything important I should know from there?

2. As far as I understand from reading everything i can in here, the important points are replacing the cam belt every 50k, and keeping it supplied with good oil. It's not a selespeed, so there's no issues there. And I'll have a look at the stuff about the temp gauge being stuck open.

3. The car I'm looking at (http://tinyurl.com/5lmpe6) has about 200k on its odo. Is this a major issue? i plan on asking the seller when I inspect next week why it was so high (long-distance driving or just a lot of city driving etc) - but is this going to cause major issues?

4. Again with that car, it's stated to having had a rebuild 20k ago and new clutch 25k ago. Would those be the main issues in a car of this kind of age?

5. How is their general reliability and servicing costs? As in how much would I be expecting to pay each year for service costs (approx or whatever...I'm not looking for a precise number)? As much as I really, really want an alfa, I obviously have to be able to afford it

6. Is there anything else you'd recommend I ask about the car or its history when I look at it? or anything I should look for?

7. I'd also like to get it inspected, because I prefer to be anal about these things. I figure that seeing if someone else (e.g. Lance Dixon I know gets an amazing rap in the forums here - certainly somewhere I'd consider going to if I bought it...not to mention joining AROC!) can inspect the car (rather than some random or RACV etc) is probably going to be more beneficial. Anyone in particular I should go to? and I'm assuming that getting it inspected won't cost more than $200 or so...

anyways thanks for your help all! I'm sorry it's so longwinded (too used to writing essays lol), and I hope I haven't repeated questions...I tried to read everything I could here but there's always those things you miss!

hughstephens

[Scott Farquharson]

Hi Hugh,

Not sure why no one has answered this but:

1.  Not sure about the article

2. Right on

3. 200k is a lot for any car so it is likely that things will start to be needing replacement - brake rotors for example, you may also get little failures form time to time - I had a crank sensor fail recently.  Get the car checked is all you can do - get as few k's with service history as you can afford but of course this is still no guarentee.  Remeber they are not Toyota's.

4. What was rebuilt?  gearbox and clutch?  there are some people that have had gearbox problems and some that have been fine.

5. These cars are as reliable as any other modern euro car - service would average out at a few hundred PA

6. Check the many other threads on the forum re 156's

7.  Check the sponsors page - all are well qualified to help

Good luck

[John Hanslow]

Hi there Hugh.

I saw the article in Auto Italia noting the timing belt issues, noisy variator due to oil starvationetc .. as Scott said, check out carefully the other threads here.

Get the car checked out by a Alfa dealer or Alfa specialist  - refer to our sponsors page.  The cost of a full pre-purchase inspection will save you money in the long run as any issue is a good barganing tool on price.

Come along to the next club night and talk to the club members who drive the cars.  More importantly, come along to our annual "Spettacolo" at Como Park on the 23rd November  and look at the cars, features and options etc - and you never know might see one for sale.

Good luck.

[vjr]

5. These cars are as reliable as any other modern euro car - service would average out at a few hundred PA

I know this thread is dead, but I have calculated some figures for past maintenance on my newly purchased '99 156 (I have receipts from Sep 2002 until now, Dec 2008, or about 72,000Km). Anyone purchasing an Alfa (especially an 18 y.o as in this thread!) should take note of the following.

My car is a 1 owner, and has been meticulously maintained by only Alfa specialists (John Blair Prahran, then Italian Motor Company/Robert Lane Brighton). The previous owner paid a total of $9,134.60 in maintenance over the last 5 1/2 years, which equates to about $1,685.25 per year, or about $4.68 per day. This does not include approx $900 in tyres last year. Definitely more than a few hundred per year. Of course, YMMV, but anyone about to get into Alfas should take this into account!

I'd be interested in other people's experiences for comparison.

[Scott Farquharson]

I'd be very interested in the breakdown of the $9k+.  Sound like a lot and I would imagine some major failure.

I had a cambelt break @ 60k prior to the change in servicing intervals and had to replace the selespeed pump but other than that it has been the standard servicing each year.

[vjr]

Hi. Here's the break down. I've indicated the most expensive part of each service (not including labour). I'd be interested in hearing if this is 'normal' or not  Thanks.

51423   $378.85   17/09/2002
67857   $1,040.95   12/03/2003   <- brake pads & calipers
69201   $1,109.60   23/12/2003   <- timing belt, belt tensioner, balance belt, cam cover gasket
72693   $1,481.10   22/04/2004   <- phase variator & advance valve
82216   $884.60   03/01/2005
~90000   $594.25   
103716   $2,126.95   23/02/2007   <- brake discs & pads, spark plugs
-----      $175.00   ------         <-battery
107420   $410.80   06/06/2007   <- voltage regulator
115702   $932.50   21/02/2008   <- aux drive belt

[Scott Farquharson]

Hi. Here's the break down. I've indicated the most expensive part of each service (not including labour). I'd be interested in hearing if this is 'normal' or not  Thanks.

51423   $378.85   17/09/2002
67857   $1,040.95   12/03/2003   <- brake pads & calipers
69201   $1,109.60   23/12/2003   <- timing belt & balance belt
72693   $1,481.10   22/04/2004   <- phase variator & advance valve
82216   $884.60   03/01/2005
~90000   $594.25   
103716   $2,126.95   23/02/2007   <- brake discs & pads, spark plugs
-----      $175.00   ------         <-battery
107420   $410.80   06/06/2007   <- voltage regulator
115702   $932.50   21/02/2008   <- aux drive belt

I have 180k kms on mine - how many on the above?
I just had ABS do my brakes - rotors and pads - $650 - fitted - not sure why calipers were replaced in the above list - mistake?  genuine Alfa brakes are very expensive hence using ABS
cam belt service is about $900 per 60k kms, i did also have a crank sensor fail recently which was around $400 i think
things like brakes/belts are the same for most euro makes
the few hundred per year i mentioned referred to std servicing - oil plugs etc
there are quite a few big numbers in there which i would suggest is not the norm
any other views?

[vjr]

I have 180k kms on mine - how many on the above?
I just had ABS do my brakes - rotors and pads - $650 - fitted - not sure why calipers were replaced in the above list - mistake?  genuine Alfa brakes are very expensive hence using ABS
cam belt service is about $900 per 60k kms, i did also have a crank sensor fail recently which was around $400 i think
things like brakes/belts are the same for most euro makes
the few hundred per year i mentioned referred to std servicing - oil plugs etc
there are quite a few big numbers in there which i would suggest is not the norm
any other views?

That list of services is up-to-date. It's now done 122K's. Yes calipers was my mistake.. I've corrected the list.

Labour for services ranged from $200 flat up to $600+ (for the $2100 service when the brake pads/discs were done).

I guess that's my point.. there's no such thing as 'standard servicing' for a 156. Every service needs something extra (at the very least a few light bulbs  ). Nearly $1,700 per year is just outrageous. The Italian Job have quoted me around $1200-1500 for my next visit.. service + timing belt + stuffed thermostat, so I'm pretty much on track to continue the trend. Anyway I'm not here to whinge, just curious if others' experience is similar.

[Jekyll and Hyde]

67857   $1,040.95   12/03/2003   <- brake pads
72693   $1,481.10   22/04/2004   <- phase variator & advance valve
103716   $2,126.95   23/02/2007   <- brake discs & pads, spark plugs
107420   $410.80   06/06/2007   <- voltage regulator
115702   $932.50   21/02/2008   <- aux drive belt

Those are the ones that seem out to me.  Those brake costs seem very high, especially if thats minus the labour to fit.  Phase variator and voltage regulator are not common items to fault.  And the aux drive belt is way off, if its referring to the belt which drives the alternator and aircon etc - that belt should cost absolute maximum of $100 or so, plus maybe an hour or so in labour to fit.  Unless there are a number of other things included in some of these items that you haven't mentioned, I'd suggest the previous owner paid too much....

[vjr]

Those are the ones that seem out to me.  Those brake costs seem very high, especially if thats minus the labour to fit.  Phase variator and voltage regulator are not common items to fault.  And the aux drive belt is way off, if its referring to the belt which drives the alternator and aircon etc - that belt should cost absolute maximum of $100 or so, plus maybe an hour or so in labour to fit.  Unless there are a number of other things included in some of these items that you haven't mentioned, I'd suggest the previous owner paid too much....

TurboGTV, PM sent. thanks.

[Davidm1600]

Just noticed this thread, have obviously been spending far too much of my online Alfa time over at the BB. 

Still to reflect on the costs of ownership of a 156, well mine is a '03 JTS Sportwagon, and apart from the purchase cost, registering it in Tassie, petrol, and a little oil, the car has cost me absolutely nicks, nothing to date.  Mine was a 1 owner from new with 89Km on the clock, its now done, 96.5Km and has run like a dream.  The only thing I have had to do to it in the past year was tighten up some screws for the stone tray. 

So obviously so far I have done exceptionally well.  Am I happy, what do you think.  Obviously, at some point in the not too distant future it will require a service but so far so good.  Dave

[vjr]

Just noticed this thread, have obviously been spending far too much of my online Alfa time over at the BB. 

Still to reflect on the costs of ownership of a 156, well mine is a '03 JTS Sportwagon, and apart from the purchase cost, registering it in Tassie, petrol, and a little oil, the car has cost me absolutely nicks, nothing to date.  Mine was a 1 owner from new with 89Km on the clock, its now done, 96.5Km and has run like a dream.  The only thing I have had to do to it in the past year was tighten up some screws for the stone tray. 

So obviously so far I have done exceptionally well.  Am I happy, what do you think.  Obviously, at some point in the not too distant future it will require a service but so far so good.  Dave

Hi, thanks for the input. Mine has done a similar amount as yours since it's last service, about 7,500k's, without any money being spent (although I feel I have a 'left-over' expense which should've been done before now--the thermostat). Anyway let me know when you hit 100k

[Davidm1600]

Hey VJR, I hope my posting didn't come across as being smug, since it is more from a sense of relief and happiness.  From what I can tell, perhaps I have been lucky or alternatively simply bought well.  Either way, I am sure it will cost me money in the future. 

Similarly, I also expect it to loose value from what I paid, $20K.  But I guess that is to be expected, especially when you see 156 sedans on Fleabay for less than $10K.  I guess the only thing I can do is to either accept that and keep it for many years or alternatively get out at some point in time in the future before it depreciates too much.  The balancing act to consider.  I am sure that over the next year it will go past 100Km, and obviously need to have the belts changed etc.  Something also to allow for.  The main thing is to maintain the service and look after the car as well as possible.  Well thats my approach.  Dave

[vjr]

Hey VJR, I hope my posting didn't come across as being smug, since it is more from a sense of relief and happiness.  From what I can tell, perhaps I have been lucky or alternatively simply bought well.  Either way, I am sure it will cost me money in the future. 

Similarly, I also expect it to loose value from what I paid, $20K.  But I guess that is to be expected, especially when you see 156 sedans on Fleabay for less than $10K.  I guess the only thing I can do is to either accept that and keep it for many years or alternatively get out at some point in time in the future before it depreciates too much.  The balancing act to consider.  I am sure that over the next year it will go past 100Km, and obviously need to have the belts changed etc.  Something also to allow for.  The main thing is to maintain the service and look after the car as well as possible.  Well thats my approach.  Dave

No not at all. I'm actually very pleased with my car, especially for $9,000  . I think its only owner before me did not spare any expense on its upkeep, which is why I jumped at it, even though I was hoping for a '00 or '01 model. But, I saw some newer cars than mine in pretty ordinary condition. Once I'm over the imminent service with timing belt change I hope to have as little expense as is possible with an Alfa I just hope I can afford to keep servicing it at Alfa specialists!

[John Hanslow]

Here is an indicative link only, not promoting the site or service.  I assume that the service is all by the book.

In looking at the link and changing the km's or more appropriately the years, these is a substancial difference in cost between 8 and 9 years.  I suggest as  mentioned previously that after some time it (especially with belts) its time and not distance we have to be concerned with.

You get a parts list as well so thats a bonus.

http://carservice.com.au/car-service-servicing-guide-2.aspx?sid=71480

Cheers.