thoughts?

[scuzzyGTV]

ok, here's the thing...

i'm about to start restoring my 1980 GTV. having raced karts for many years its not fast enough for hillclimbs, clubdays etc., so i'd like it to go a bit quicker. as i see it i have three options:

1. supercharge - i don't know why but i'd like to give it a go. i know it wont be cost effective, but we are talking alfas here. ideally i'd like a car that is unique. this would be a strip the motor job, replace internals, add intercooler etc.

2. turbocharge - this is a less preferred option, but ultimately it will do exactly the same job as a supercharger.

3. standard - do the car up as standard plus injection & cams (it already has high compression pistons), save some more cash and buy something quick and different (i.e a tvr).

i'd like to get some alfisti input, especially as when its done i'd like to come to the mainland and do some track days, and am unsure of requirements/regulations in regard to those.

i'd also like to get some better idea of cost if anyone has tried the first two options.

oh, also just so you don't get the wrong idea, brakes, suspension, tyre and transmission works go without saying.

thanks

scott.

[jimnielsen]

Hi Scott. - as you have said - check the rules and regulations! Its easy to make a few mods that would put you in racing class - but not have the car actually able to go any faster than a standard class car. I'd suggest that if you have mods in mind that you stick to what would allow you to run in 'modified class' (as its currently cast here in Victoria..). Basically forced induction is out for a GTV unless you want to be in a class by yourself in 3L+ racing class!!

cheers jimn~

[AndrewO]

Hi,

If you have a look at alfabb.com there's a guy there (I think his name is Greg Gordon) who sells a supercharger kit for GTV6's and he says he's in the final stages of development for a supercharger for the 4 cylinder engines.  He's written a book on supercharging and seems to be friendly enough to answer all sorts of questions.

I just know enough to say to ask someone else.


Andrew

[1750GT]

Aparently the 2lt lends itself to turbo charging but I don't know about super-charging. But I agree with jimn that if your going to race then you need to look carefully at what you can and can't do, otherwise you end up in a class where you get polaxed every outing.

The 2lt is an exceptional engine indeed and does lend itself to tuning without the need to go mucking with either turbo's and super-chargers. But (and I know it's a 105) if you want to really go spastic, put the following link into your internet browser and discover the stangalfa!

http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2008/09/alfa-romeo-gtv-with-ford-mustang-v8.html

1750GT

[Sheldon McIntosh]

Here's a site regarding a Vic members' supercharged twin cam.  http://gtv.seddon.ca/SCALFA/gtv/index.htm

Of course, there was also the factory turbocharged Alfetta too  http://www.classicandperformancecar.com/front_website/octane_interact/carspecs.php/?see=2991 
There is a factory Turbodelta in the club, I'm hoping to feature it in the magazine later this year.

So, yes, both are do-able.

[1750GT]

Still think a stangalfa has some real merit if you want to go spastic with your alfa. But with regard to the turbo delta, a quick calc tells me that 150 bhp is about 110w, less than a 2.5lt six? Whats the point?

1750GT

[Simon Aarons]

From what i know.... which is not too much - The Turbodelta was also made in the early 80's, the one in the club is an 83'. Apparently they were brought into the country as a standard two litre then converted here (if i am wrong please correct me).

They also received a cooler looking bonnet with air vents for the turbo, up-rated shocks, slotted front discs and larger front calipers. Here is the link to the one that is in the club:

http://www.alfaclubvic.org.au/forum/index.php?topic=66.0

From memory the car now has around 120hp at the rear wheels with the turbo wound down and no intercooler. And it will easily pull away from my GTV6.

There is also one for sale on carsales:

http://www.carsales.com.au/used-cars/private/ALFA_ROMEO/GTV/details.aspx?R=1789354&Make=ALFA%20ROMEO&__Ns=pCar_PrivateSpecialFlag_Int32%7c1%7c%7cpCar_ImageCount_Int32%7c1%7c%7cpCar_LastModifiedDate_DateTime%7c1&Model=GTV&__N=4294967249%200%20834%20257%201216%204294967199%20285&State=All%20States&distance=25&silo=1003&seot=0&Cr=13&__Nne=20&trecs=36&state_id=0&__sid=11F6660C5B71

[Barry Edmunds]

Some years ago, well quite a lot actually, a club member had one of the turbo Alfettas and it proved to be a mechanical nightmare with so many quirks and reliability hassles that I am sure caused him to eventually give up on the car as a bad investment with the problems putting the car off the road (and track) more often that it was on.
Obviously a lot has changed over the years, both in knowledge and technology, but anyone wanting to get involved with a turbo Alfa should ensure that they have either the knowledge and or technology, or access to same, before getting too excited.
Quirks and reliability aside I guess it would still be a lot of fun to punt one of these in anger on the odd occasion.
Barry

[Sheldon McIntosh]

But with regard to the turbo delta, a quick calc tells me that 150 bhp is about 110w, less than a 2.5lt six? Whats the point?

I know, I keep saying the same thing to the people in Twinspark 75s who keep beating me in my V6!!

The turbo would weigh less than a 6, and would probably have better torque as well.

Aside from that, the point of the turbo was originally just to homologate the turbo for racing and rallying, where they produced around 300bhp.  They were installed on GTVs in 1979-80.  The Aussie ones were a kit that were fitted to both coupes and sedans, and included bigger brakes off a Commodore and better shocks, among other things.

[scuzzyGTV]

thanks for the advise so far.

what i read into this is ensure that i comply with any relevant regs (which classes run in events such as the 6hr enduro and phillip island classic?) and i should only go ahead with it if i have a lot of time/money to iron out niggles.

obviously this isnt too much of a surprise, but i'm certainly considering a n/a tune at the moment, and save for something a bit quicker in the future.

the other thing i forgot to mention is that i'd still like to keep the gtv on the road, and at this stage i'm not sure who the transport engineers are. i think there is one in the italian car club here, but i'll have to check.

anyhow i'll start to do some work on it, its in a pretty rough state now and load some pics to keep you all happy/horrified!

scott.

[Davidm1600]

Its late and I really should have gone to bed but I just noticed this query and thought I might add my 2 cents worth.  You ask about the options of either supercharging or turbo charging your GTV, have you given any thought of trying both. 

There is a guy over here in Hobart, who used to live in Melbourne, and who is posting a thread on the AlfaBB detailing the engineering and expected outcome of going down this road.  His name is Mike Barrenger and he is in the process of installing both.  His project is based on a '76 Alfetta GT and in discussion with him he expects his car will produce around 300-400 BHP.  Pretty impressive stuff.  I can't recall his handle off hand or the title of the thread but perhaps someone else will. 

Mike is an engineer and has had some pretty interesting discussions in the thread concerning all the engineering calculations and detailed the extent of the engine build.  Definitely worth checking out.  Dave