rear hub conversion?

[alfagtv152]

Hi Guys,
I am with MD on this one,if you are good at welding,measuring and using a 9" (on a hoist for me)then go for it.I run a cut up the De Dion tube about 7/8 of the way up,near to the original weld and drive a wedge of a given thickness into each cut until you have the amount of camber you are looking for then check measure the track front and rear of the back wheels with the wheels on,set the toe where you want it and tack the tubes up but as Mikey said be very carefull to keep checking and weld a bit every where so it doesnt pull out the alignment.Works a treat but it's not adjustable!.
Cheers
Andrew

[MD]

See photo for what is under discussion.

See second photo if you want it adjustable and you own a stock exchange.

*Welding photo courtesy AlfaGTV6.com

[alfagtv152]

As far as hub changes go it's not that hard really.If you just want to change the hubs all you need to do is use a 3/4 breaker bar with a 36mm 3/4 drive impact socket on the nut while the car is sitting on it's wheels to undo it,then jack it up take off the wheel and use a puller to pull the hub out,they aren't that tight in the bearing in my experience.To refit the 5 stud ones just assemble it and make sure you do that nut up tight again after.
To replace the bearing,once you have the hub out disconnect the axle and remove it.I then just use a puller made out of a threaded rod or 14mm bolt with fine thread and some bits of tube,a bit of channel and something solid enough to grab the bearing inner.Once the retainer is removed you should be able to wind it out,I think I pulled it out using the inner(makes it a binner! ha ha) and pulled it back in by the outer so as not damage it.I did notice that German made bearings have no play in them new but Italian ones do!.
Its not hard to improvise special tools if you have a grasp of the engineering principles involved,or am I grasping my tool!s?.I stuck a couple of pictures of some rudamentary pullers for the bearing and the rear transaxle mount.
Cheers
Andrew

[alfagtv152]

Hi MD,
I notice you did yours from the top down,I did mine from the bottom up in the same manner.
Cheers
Andrew

[bt46]

Thanks guys.
The photos are great.
Just wondering how you measure the wheel alighnment on the hoist as you adjust.
String line?
Degree wheel?
Cheers

[MD]

In my case, it has to be on the wheel aligner at the time of stitching up. As Andrew and I have said, you need to carefully wedge the cuts and progressively weld whilst continually monitoring your settings as the welding itself will want to create a greater angle than you may want or worse, you will wind up with one value on the left and a different value on the right.

I set them at 0* toe and 3.5* camber. As you know the factory setting is 0* toe and 0.5* camber. I hope that helps.

[alfagtv152]

Hi bt46,
MD did it with the proper measuring equipment,I am a little more instinctive shall we say,I measured centre to centre(from the centre of left to the centre of the right wheels) before any work was done,with the wheels on so you have as big a diameter as possible.If it is even as it should be and you have no reason to doubt the correctness of the current set up then you can begin.Cut one side and wedge it across the diameter of the tube checking the measurements front and back of the wheels to keep it straight as far as toe goes,to measure the camber I used an old engineering tool which has a spirit level in a gauge that you adjust and it tells you the degrees from vertical,I cant think of the proper name for it!!.You will need to be sure the De Dion frame is level to use a tool with a spirit level in it for the camber.
When you have the camber you want start tacking it up carefully as we have said and weld it up if you like.
Once you have done one side repeat the process on the other side.If you can lock up the back wheels with the hand brake and mark your measuring points on the tyre front and back you will keep some consistency.
You can remove and refit the wheel during the process for access but always put it back the same way,this is the way I do it from the bottom up.
Hope that helps
Cheers
Andrew

[dehne]

MD
i just took a look at ur pic for the camber and it totally different to how i will do mine, what i will be doing is to move the roll centre to the bottom and the cut the top of the de-dion around half way (middle back over the top the middle front) then just put a little weight on it and its done weld up and alls happy no heat going anywhere near bearings

i will post pics as im doing it just to show all how i have done it to
the father inlaw has had it done this way on his r/c for about 5/6 years and it works fine

[alfagtv152]

Hi Dehne,
I need the pictures please,I cant make any sense of your description.
Cheers
Andrew

[dehne]

i get a pic of one that has already been done tomorrow and post it up, ill take a pic of the straps that have been put on it also

[MD]

Andrew, I think dehne is going to make one cut in the centre of the DeDion tube after lowering the watts link central fixing point. (his roll centre move).

..er good luck mate.

[dehne]

here is one that we have done before

[dehne]

some pics with the straps,
be cutting and welding here it also changes the toe in a bit to but not sure by how much

[MD]

So dehne. How much camber and toe is on that conversion?

[dehne]

neg 2 camber and somewhere around 1 deg toe in i think but not 100% sure