Knocking Noise suspension - Upper control arms or steering rack?

[lmcpaulm]

Ok - So I have had a knocking noise under my footwell in an Alfa 156 V6 2004 (73,000km) that only appears over bumps and when the car is cold (ie it goes away somewhat after 30-40 mins of driving).

The lower control arms were showing wear so I had them replaced.... still knocking

I have ordered upper control arms and drop links from the UK that have arrived (genuine alfa) and will get these put on next week.

But in the mean time, I took my 156 to Pedders who did their 28point check and only came up with 2 problems with the suspension, the upper control arms had a small amount of play and the steering rack as well. They said the steering rack could make a knocking noise too! It appears steering racks are a big job to replace, re-condition....

Any thoughts on what it is more likely to be? and is it better to save some money and get both dealt with at the same time?

[Davidm1600]

I havn't heard of a problem with the steering rack before, re knocking noises.   

I too have had a knocking noise in the front end of my 156 for a while now.  It doesn't seem to affect how the car handles, but like yourself, I too have bought new (original) uppers for mine out of the UK, from EB Spares.  I will be interested to see if that gets rid of the noise or not.  I was advised to replace the tops first, rather than the lower arms.

I also bought some new front sway bar bushes as my car tends to get squeaky when it is not raining.  Again I am hopeful this will solve the problem.   Thereafter I am going to replace the shockies in my car as they are definitely tired and EB can do me a set of 4 Bilstein B4s for around 240 UK pounds plus shipping. 

Will be interested how you go in sorting out whether or not the rack is also contributing to such noises.

[lmcpaulm]

  damn you have the same problem - the knocking is getting on my nerves... you're right it doesn't affect the handling.

Re steering rack: in addition to Pedders this concerned me - http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-147-156-and-gt/129961-faulty-steering-rack-156-v6.html

Re: shockies - Check out shop4parts.co.uk they have both aftermarket and genuine Alfa parts - with postage it worked out cheaper than anyone in Aus for me.

[Davidm1600]

Yes I suspect so.  The noise in mine too seems worse first thing in the morning, but at times you will still hear it even after some distance.  Mostly a problem on rougher road surfaces.  Mind you the other half's beemer also has such noises from the front of her car.

Thanks for the link to the other forum.  I made a note of all the other possible noise sources, in case replacing the upper arms doesn't solve the problem.  The track rod ends certainly sound like they too could be a culpret.

Thanks also on the headsup on the other site re shockies.  I too had come to the conclusion that buying them locally was going to be expensive.  I previously had been quoted well over $1K for either konis or bilsteins, while around $800 for Boge.  Hence was most impressed with the price for bilsteins from EB Spares.

Good luck in solving the clunking noise in your 156.

[colcol]

Most of the time its the top control arms, and here is a thought, if the factory ones are wearing out at 75-100 thousand kls, has any one tried non genuine top control arms, there are some on ebay at the moment for $130 for both, with a 20,000kls warranty sold by auto chassis kings, Colin.

[wankski]

why? they are only like 50 quid genuine... can be had for less at other UK vendors, around 40...

btw, alfa doesn't make them, but there are like 2-3 oem makers for it, but some of the off brands are pretty bad....

IIRC trw is among the best of them.

http://www.ebspares.co.uk/PNF/PNF.cfm?id=/alfa_156/Original_Top_wishbone_Left/info.cfm&CFID=555830&CFTOKEN=8df8ce2c4aa6cdcb-6034A3FD-155D-210D-9B712B628A848A48&jsessionid=f03069dd97546d56c1268445542412d797b4

[lmcpaulm]

did you swap the sway bar linkages?

Getting done next week. Droplinks and sway bar links appear to be the same thing. 

btw, alfa doesn't make them, but there are like 2-3 oem makers for it, but some of the off brands are pretty bad....

I've heard the same, and some are shocking supposedly.


Well, it's getting booked in! Better not hear a peep out of this car for a while... In the last 2 1/2 years I have had:
- battery problems
- 12V socket stop
- wiper blade problems
- indicators jam
- fuel gauge lying!
- now this knocking noise

The joys of owning an Alfa! 

Btw - does anyone know what would cause the 12V socket to stop? It's not the fuse and I haven't gotten around to sorting it yet 

[Davidm1600]

Most of the time its the top control arms, and here is a thought, if the factory ones are wearing out at 75-100 thousand kls, has any one tried non genuine top control arms, there are some on ebay at the moment for $130 for both, with a 20,000kls warranty sold by auto chassis kings, Colin.

Hey Col, yes I know I was looking at these on ebay, but when I got in touch with EB Spares, and discussed it with them, they advised me they won't stock the generic brand ones as they had a lot of problems, recalls with them over in the UK.  Besides at 48 quid a piece for Alfa parts and a little extra for delivery it seemed a no brainer to me.  The other thing too is that EB advised that you need to replace the top bolt and nut when changing the top arms.  The ebay seller doesn't have these nor mentioned this.

6 quid for a couple of sway bar bushes seemed pretty decent price too to me, ditto what they quoted for the Bilsteins. Sure glad my 156 has been pretty much trouble free and so reliable. 

[colcol]

Thanks davidm1750, i was curious as to what these non genuine parts were like as they had a 20,000 warranty, most of the time genuine parts are the best, but sometimes you hope someone has worked out how to make the control arms last more than 100,000k, Colin.

[bix]

After I too had knocking noises in the 156 (107,000k) I just had my uppers, lowers and anti-roll bars (sway bars - including PU bushings) replaced by Maranello pur Sang who did a tremendous job. Just had it at Winton today - and tight as a you know what!

[jayarr]

Hi,

I've got some front suspension noise now in my 156, at 117k. I wonder whether Alfa are more prone to suspension bush wear than other manufacturers vehicles by virtue of designing for roadholding, feel, lightness of unsuspended parts. Perhaps they all wear the same but Alfa drivers notice these things more  Regardless, at least Alfa have revised the parts, and I'm its due to owner comments, rather than warranty claims.

The EB Spares prices look pretty inviting. Looks like I have another job to look forward to in Spring.

[bix]

You can purchase replacement PU bushes for the top wishbones, which apparently work quite well: http://ebspares.co.uk/PNF/PNF.cfm?id=/alfa_156/Superflex_replacement_bushes_for_top_wishbones/info.cfm&CFID=1223000&CFTOKEN=5478d696da776485-A165A9ED-155D-210D-9BA0D957DF536F7B&jsessionid=f0308115e798818a999b301979c1a4e1f495
However this doesn't address the balljoint if that is worn, and if you spend the time getting to the top-wishbone, you might as well replace the lot.
If the car has done over 100k, I'd also recommend during this whole process to replace the shockers as well. Alfisti.net have currently a good price on the Eibach pro-suspension kit which is highly rated - for well under AUD$1000.

[Davidm1600]

Hi Jayarr, not too sure about that or not.  My partners '97 3 series BMW has suspension knocks in the front, and it has slightly less than my 156.  My car has had knocking sounds for possibly the last 2-3K but will be sorted very shortly once I can get it to my mechanics, given I have the parts now.

I suspect in reality it is more to do with the inbuilt obsolescence of most cars rather than simply being an integral aspect of Alfa design characteristics.  The late model Audi A4 wagon I had a ride in today also had a number of knocks and squeaks coming from various parts of the car.

[L4OMEO]

Hi imcpaulm

I'm also in the process of replacing my upper arms, lower wishbones and sway-bar drop links, and have a couple of questions for you:

- did you go for the non-genuine items at shop4parts?
- did you also order new top nut & bolt, and new bolts for the lower wishbones?
- I see you're in QLD - who is installing the parts for you, and what have they quoted for labour?

If you'd prefer not to answer these publicly I'd really appreciate a quick PM.

Many thanks
Rory

[colcol]

Hey imcpaulm, you said you had battery problems,what sort of battery problems, i am interested in what brand of battery's Alfa drivers use in their 156's, 12 volt socket, it is quite easy to pull that flip down lid out and check out the wiring on the ciggy socket, i replaced mine with a twin socket from Jaycar that don't have lighters, but fit GPS's and MP3 sockets better and the sockets don't fall out, wiper blade problems, what the normal chattering wipers, i replaced mine with over the counter at Repco blades and they worked a treat and it was one of the easiest jobs i ever did, indicators jamm, no idea, mine are still working ok, maybe spray some silicone spray into the switch for a bit of lubrication, fuel gauge lying, obviously your fuel gauge thinks its in Politics, keep us updated with all your dramas, Colin.