Front suspension rebuild

[1750GTV]

Some time ago I promised myself that I'd rebuild both the front and rear suspension on my 1750GTV. 
Apart from new shock absorbers some years ago, as far as I know neither the front nor rear suspension has had any major work done since the car was new and whilst I thought it drove OK, I recently drove another car with a restored standard suspension and the contrast was dramatic. Over the last month I've completed rebuilding the rear suspension which was quite easy. The difference in handling with just a rebuilt rear suspension was very noticeable.

Now I'm tackling the front.
So far I've stripped both sides to the hubs and am waiting on an 'all-thread' spring remover so I can lower the pans without having the springs fly out from under the car and rip my head off ....
I've photographed everything as well as measuring and tagging the important bits and have ordered new bushes, bearings, tie-rods, idler kit and a couple of second hand lower suspension arms as mine have had grease nipples drilled into them many years ago.

I'm still thinking about new shock absorbers and will probably go with Koni Yellows on the front and Reds on the rear as the car is only ever used on the road.

I've attached some photos.

Chris

[AikenDrum105]

It will transform the car -  great project !

For Spring peace of mind - I hook a chain around spring and link it with a d-shackle,  not tightly to stop it extending - just to contain it if it does make a run for it

I was talking to a nice bloke out at Milano's not long ago,  who's name escapes me (was another customer there at the time)  but he mentioned using some bearings between the double nuts on the end of the all-thread and the pan - you had to use a couple of different size washers so the outside of the bearing race was hard against the pan / arm, and the inside was tight against the double-nuts...    I haven't done it myself yet - but sounded like a nifty idea to make it a little easier / reduce the load on the all-thread a bit.  He said it stops the all-thread and nuts chewing out as quickly.

That and an air ratchet   - makes it a doddle,  unless of course you want to work on the guns when you do it

You're probably all over that stuff already - but just thought I'd throw it out there

Cheers,

[1750GTV]

Thanks Scott.

The chain/D-shackle sounds like a good idea.

I'll post more photos as I go along.
I realize that it's not the most thrilling thread and probably has been covered in depth on other forums, but someone might be interested.

Chris

[pancho]

I think it's great as a lot of these old cars are more than likley still driving around on their original bushes and setups.

Not that I have seen many 105's on freeway's but yeah great write up and I am sure a lot of budding owners would like to give it a try if they get shown how and it's not too difficult or need special tools.

[1750GTV]

It's not difficult at all - or not so far

This afternoon I removed the passenger side spring by sequentially lowering the pan using three long headless (all-thread) bolts with double nuts on the top and an appropriately sized spacer on the bottom so I could get easy access to the bottom nut. I'm told you can use two, but I thought three was safer. You just go around loosening each bottom nut a few threads at a time. The front springs are under considerable tension being normally compressed to about half their natural length so the car needs to be jacked up a fair way. This method is very easy, very safe and, as they say, when the time comes, installation is the reverse of removal. Both rubber seats for the spring were in very bad shape and the pan was full of 40 years worth of dirt and grease though I'm sure it will all clean up very nicely. Couldn't see any spacers on this side.

The lower control arm bushes were completely knackered with lots of movement - no rubber left at all and the only reason the suspension felt 'tight' was because of the spring tension. The upper control arm bush also had a lot of play in it. To remove the upper control arm on this side (intake side) I'll have to remove the airbox - the one on the exhaust side should be a lot simpler.

So far so good.

Chris

[dmgrai]

Could I just add my $0.02 worth - this is a most useful post, very informative and not boring at all. I'll follow it with interest as I'm contemplating the same job here.

Chris, where did you source the new parts for the project? Here (i.e. Oz) or through one of the UK suppliers?

David Grainger

[1750GTV]

Thanks David.

Most of the parts came from the major UK Alfa suppliers. Their websites are very helpful and unfortunately years ahead of the local Oz suppliers. I'm up for new shockies sometime and will buy these locally.

I've spent the weekend stripping the rest of the suspension and only have one recalcitrant bolt left - the inner bolt on the RHS upper suspension arm. It's been sprayed liberally with WD40 and I'll attack it again one evening this week.

I've posted some photos of the parts that I've removed. The LHS pan is badly rusted with a couple of extra holes so I'll replace it with a new one and the steering track rod (drag link) has a bend in it so it's up for renewal as well. All the other parts have been degreased, wire brushed clean and coated with an antirust paint. They will eventually get a top coat of black paint.

Next big job is cleaning, rustproofing and painting the wheelwells prior to reassembly. 

So far it has been an easy job (except for that bolt) - the pan lowering spring removal tool is a godsend. Most of the major bushes had no rubber left at all with easy movement in every plane. Similarly the ball joints. I guess if this suspension can be likened to a set of human joints, then my car had a severe case of arthritis, the only difference is that this one is completely curable.

I'll keep posting photos as I go with hopefully a few more of the reassembly steps as I put it all back together. I probably should have done this years ago, but as the car doesn't get driven much and felt OK when I did drive it, the rebuild kept slipping to the backburner. What precipitated my action was driving a mates car with a rebuilt standard suspension - the difference was quite obvious. I'd be interested to hear from others how often the suspensions in these cars should be rebuilt - 41 years is obviously a bit too long

Regards,
Chris

[Davidm1600]

Hey Chris, just to confirm what you are going through, believe me it is most definitely worth doing.  In fact it was the first real major expense I spent on buying my '69 1750 GTV.  I went with both Koni yellows front and rear. I had the same setup on my 2l Berlina before hand and have the same for my '69 Fiat AC 124 sport.

But yes rebuilding the suspension makes a huge difference in handling and overall feel of security on the road.  Oh that and some decent tyres  .  Enjoy the project.

[1750GTV]

As far as shockies go, I was going to fit Koni yellows on the front and reds on the back.
Because of the live rear axle, I'm told that these cars had deliberately long travel, soft rear suspensions in an attempt to at least keep one rear wheel on the road at all times. As the car will only ever be used for lightweight road work, I'm keen to keep to the original design philosophy.
What do you think?
Chris

[cjheath]

I was going to fit Koni yellows on the front and reds on the back.

That's what I have now, after more than a decade of reds all round. My yellows are centered, and the reds tight. I can't say it's definitely better than it was, as I have different rubber than ever before, but I'm certainly getting heaps of grip. Like you, I spend minimal time on a track, but I corner as if I was

[Colin Byrne]

Hi chris, i'm tipping you'll get a massive benefit from doing all this work, a couple of things you might want to consider to make the most of your efforts.
- Don't neglect the condition of the steering box at a minimum ensure you have the correct shim stack for the preload, this can be done with the box in the car
- follow the workshop instructions concerning setting the toe, as incorrect steering link lengths will change the ackerman curve and effect the handling
- The lower control arm inboard bushes are under incredibly high loads due to the spring motion ratio, so make sure you get all that right
- The soft rear setup is more a function of the rear roll centre height rather than having something to do with the live rear end, be careful with going to stiff in either spring rate or dampers at the rear, or the car will be even more diabolical in the wet
Good luck

[1750GTV]

Hi chris, i'm tipping you'll get a massive benefit from doing all this work

I'm certainly hoping so.

- follow the workshop instructions concerning setting the toe, as incorrect steering link lengths will change the ackerman curve and effect the handling

I've bought new track rods as well as tie rods and will set up the steering assembly as close to it was when I pulled it out of the car. Once back on the road, I'll get a professional wheel alignment done.

- The lower control arm inboard bushes are under incredibly high loads due to the spring motion ratio, so make sure you get all that right

They will be tightened to a torque of 60-65 ftlb under load. I believe this is the correct figure.

- The soft rear setup is more a function of the rear roll centre height rather than having something to do with the live rear end, be careful with going to stiff in either spring rate or dampers at the rear, or the car will be even more diabolical in the wet

The rear was rebuilt with standard bushes and springs. The only nonstandard part was a new high tensile aluminium trunnion with poly conical bushes.

- Don't neglect the condition of the steering box at a minimum ensure you have the correct shim stack for the preload, this can be done with the box in the car

The steering box was rebuilt and properly set up about 3 years ago. The main problems with it were a leaking bottom seal and a loose castellated nut !

Thanks for the input, I appreciate it. I'll keep you all updated.

Chris

[1750GTV]

Spent the weekend trying to remove the last suspension component - the upper control arm on the drivers side. The large bolt that secures the inner bush is rusted on to the inner sleeve and I can't budge it despite liberal doses of WD40. I've tried all manner of force and even went to the extent of removing the inner headlight so I could thread a large 'punch' (crowbar) through and onto the nut. No go. The nut is loose but the bolt is jammed. I can rotate it because the rubber is so perished it has come away from the inner and outer sleeves. I guess there has to be one tricky bit.
The one on the LHS came out very easily and every other part of the 41yo suspension has been quite easy to disassemble.
A mate of mine is coming over later in the week - he's a panelbeater and will bring a variety of dollies and a bigger mallet. I refuse to be beaten by a steel bolt

I gave up on Sunday before I damaged either myself or the car and started cleaning instead - managed to uncover original paint under all of the grime and grease. When I cleaned the rear wheel wells there was a lot of original paint missing so I rustproofed the metal before painting it with a few coats of hard wearing black paint. I'll do the same on the front.

Chris

[pancho]

I was getting the sound deadener material off the front wheel arches of my car over the weekend in prep for blasting and noted the lack of the material in 30 % of the wheel arch area. Just white paint instead... Makes you wonder why they just rust like mad.

[dmgrai]

"Spent the weekend trying to remove the last suspension component - the upper control arm on the drivers side. The large bolt that secures the inner bush is rusted on to the inner sleeve and I can't budge it despite liberal doses of WD40."

Chris - I feel the pain - I've had some success in freeing off frozen/rusted components by using a 50:50 mixture of acetone (from the local pharmacy, about $5 a bottle) and auto transmission fluid. The mixture seems to creep in to the slightest gap. I learned about it while restoring old (English) motorbikes and had lots of opportunity to attest to its effectiveness.

BTW, I now have a box of ball joints and tie rod ends from Classic Alfa in the UK and when I can summon up the courage I'll start doing the suspension rebuild on my Spider, having been inspired by you. I hope I won't have the same issue with the u/control arm ...

Cheers

David G.