1983 Alfasud TI QV owners manual

[amichie]

Hi there

Does anybody have a copy of the original owners manual. Also if there is an Australian version supplement that would be even better.
I'm interested in the ignition timing section.

Thanks Andrew

[colcol]

Check ebay, they pop up from time to time, there is an owners manual that comes with the car, thats small and tells you the instructions for the car, you possibly want a workshop manual, that tells you how to fix the car in the workshop, the Haynes manual is good, there are 2 versions, early Suds and the later one, which is the early one with a supplement for the twin carbs and electronic ignition.
They vary between $10 - $100, depending on how valuable people think they are.
There is also an Autobooks???, but that doesn't cover the late models and the Genuine Alfa Romeo Manual, that doesn't cover the late models or any trim or bodywork.
By this time you can most likely download a manual or buy a CD for your computer, Colin.

[Craig_m67]

I have the owners manual and supplement for an '86 Sprint QV which is likely to be identical to the last Ti Sud. Are you after some specific timing info /data or just a copy of the manual ?

[amichie]

I have copies of both of those manuals. It seems the timing specs vary from year to year and model to model and I just wanted to see what it says in the Alfasud owners manual. My 1986 Sprint had an owners manual and a supplement for the Australian models that detailed some of the differences like the timing settings and the carb settings. Hoping to find something different for my 1983 Alfasud TI QV. BTW My Sud has a Marelli distributor with no vacuum advance.

Alfasprint Australian supplement can also be downloaded here.

http://alfasprint.extra.hu/

[colcol]

The 95 horse power and 105 horse power QV had electronic advance with relays, throttle idle and temperature inputs determining the amount of advance for pollution controls, aparantly they used to run retarded at idle to lower pollution, but as they heated up they advanced it to stop over heating, this was on the twin carb models.
The single carb models used a more conventional vacumn unit, which are known for failing dia frams, but i have seen vacumn advance units on later models.
On the pre 86 models, they are set up for leaded petrol, the 86 on are for unleaded.
My 33 TI was set up for leaded petrol and when that was phased out for unleaded petrol, it used to ping, so i had to adjust the timing to suit the unleaded petrol, that means setting the timing a bit more retarded, to get rid of the ping, Colin.

[amichie]

Mine is the twin carb type with relays. There are two sets of magnetic pick ups in the dizzy with one set slightly retarded from the other. A relay controls which pick up is used. However, at some point in time mine has been nobbled by an auto electrician and only runs off one pick up.

There was some kind of coolant temp switch that controlled the relays but that has been disconnected. I can't imagine using a relay to switch during acceleration. It would be too slow and switch bounce etc would cause a little misfire. I will trace the wiring again but it seemed to only be controlled by the coolant switch.

BTW do you have any information on the little speed sensor and electrical control box that these cars have in the engine/battery compartment? I can take pictures if required.

Andrew

[colcol]

This was a cheap fix for Australian pollution controls, the speed sensor, which i think was made by VDO, had the speedo cable from the gearbox going in one side, then another speedo went from the speed sensor to the speedo.
But the speedo cable from the gearbox used to break regulary, because of having to run sharp angles up to the sensor, and to the speedo, which sat on the bulkhead in the middle.
The fix was to use a early Sud cable, which was one piece, and twice as long, and run it directly to the speedo and bypass the speed sensor.
The electrics used to be fiddled with, the compressor for the airconditioner had a positive wire to engage the clutch, and this used to be sent to the relay that engaged the advance feature on the distributor, to increase the engine speed, to stop the engine stalling when the compressor was on.
I doubt whether any of these are still working a few decades down the track.
The 33 had an electronic Jaegar Speedo that worked on pulses from the gearbox 'chopper', Colin.

[amichie]

Hi Colin

That makes a lot of sense. My car doesn't have air-con so that may explain why the switch is disconnected. Maybe it was never fitted.

My car has log books and service receipts going back to new and the speedo drive gear broke back in 1980's I know this because the kms recorded at every service never changed. I have replaced it now and have a functioning speedo again. This also means the speed sensor is now working again also.

Do you know how the speed sensor was used as an emissions fix?

Andrew

[colcol]

No i don't know how the speedo sensor was used as an emision fix, but i would reckon that the ignition would run retarded to lower emisions, until the water temperature got hot, then a water temperature sensor would kick in and the ignition would advance.
When driving around the ignition would be running retarded, as the speedo sensor would be telling it that it is driving around and there is cool air coming through the radiator.
This is just me speculating on how all these emision fixes worked for Australia.
The 105 horse power engine was never in the Alfasuds, as they ran too dirty for our emision standards.
Then in 1984, Australia realigned its emision standard to Sweden and when the TI version of the 33 was introduced, and there was no speedo sensor as the 33 had a part time electronic speedo, Colin.

[Craig_m67]

Realigned to Sweden or Switzerland?
I only ask as I remember my supplement covered the Suiss also ( could be a poor memory)

Interesting discussion and knowledge in here, Merry Christmas

[colcol]

Hey Craig, it could be Switzerland, as i often get Sweden mixed up, but we realigned our emision laws, to make the cars cheaper and easier to comply, it was only not much different to be the same.
The wiring for the distributors is a bit shoddy, the insulation melts and the wires short out, as they are Italy's answer to England's Lucas, the prince of darkness, Colin.

[amichie]

Realigned to Sweden or Switzerland?
I only ask as I remember my supplement covered the Suiss also ( could be a poor memory)

Interesting discussion and knowledge in here, Merry Christmas

Hi there Do you have a supplement?

[colcol]

According to my supplement for a 33 TI,
There are 3 timing marks on the flywheel, visible through inspection hole at top of bell housing,
T = 'T' Top Dead Centre of cylinder no 1 and static advance at idle speed,
11 = Advance at 4,500 RPM,
1 = Not to be used.
This can be made with a timing light gun, directed at the reference pointer, visible on the opening on the rear engine cover.
Make sure the timing light is connected directly to the battery.
Run engine at idling speed until the oil temperature is 75-80c and rotate the distributor until the 'T' mark is in line with the reference pointer.
Also check that the marks '11' cut in the flywheel are in line with the reference pointer at 4,500 RPM.,Colin.

[SudSub]

Andrew, I have the Alfasud Owner's Manual and the Australian Supplement. Let me know if you are still after the information on timing and I can scan it for you.

Cheers
Lee

[amichie]

OK. Please scan and send to me

amichie67@gmail.com