147 TS (05) Gear shifter sitting to the left after replacement

[johnl]

You are 100% correct but they can be turned into a soft roader.

Crank up the rear torsion bar (of course there isn't one in the front, but that rides high anyway), throw on chopped guards/fenders, and add offroad tires, and you have the beginnings.

A 'soft' roader perhaps, but I suspect it would largely be about appearances because Mac Struts don't have nearly the off road capability as does the original Beetles' trailing arm front suspension, which is particularly good at soaking up severe bumps at speed due to the geometry of the suspension travel (i.e. the wheel moving backward as well as upward with bump motion).

Regards,
John.

[johnl]

Said they had to "make a new hole in the shifter."

I'm at a loss as to where and in what part they could have made a "new hole in the shifter", and just how this fixed the issue. The cables don't attach with bolts in holes, but with fixed posts having a ball at the end (cable end fits over ball, obviously).

Assuming they meant that they drilled a new hole in order to relocate one of the ball posts, then where and how? At the shifter the ball post is fitted to a plastic lever (not a fan of the excessive use of plastic in these shifters...), and relocating the ball post to another position on this lever would be pretty much impossible. At the gearbox end the cable is attached to a metal lever, but there is no place on this lever to which the ball post could be relocated, unless an extension was welded to the side of the lever.

Whatever, from what you say whatever they did has done what was required (i.e. moved the lever to where it is supposed to be), so without knowing the exact nature of the issue they faced I won't criticize them for thinking laterally and actually fixing your problem (well done I say). It's just all a bit strange that stock parts resulted in the lever being in a non stock position in the first place...

Regards,
John.

[poohbah]

It does sound drastic that they had to drill a new hole to get it to sit correctly.

But like Ugame, I use this workshop all the time (have for all 3 of my Alfas) and have never had any complaints about their work. They usually take me into the workshop (I was there yesterday) to show me whatever bits they have removed and where/what has failed, and shown me what they have done to fix or replace (as much as possible without having to dismantle anything).

If only for your own peace of mind (and our curiosity ) it maybe worth asking for a more detailed explanation next time you are in there if you have time.

[ugame]

Re Johnl

Yes again 100% correct on the beetle.

And yes I am equally confused as to what was drilled and where. I could feel my face going red and knew my jaw had dropped in disbelief so I left and I will go back for a fuller explanation.

Re Poohbah yep they do the same with me every time and first visit showed me my cracked assembly and the old buggered cables.

ON the return visit, as mentioned above, there was little explanation and I could feel things going south so felt it best to leave an come back in a calmer mood another day.

From here, I plan to have a look at the cables myself, see if they ARE adjustable, and then go back in for a friendly chat.

They were low on staff on the day (I did offer to come back another day), and I think pulling it apart and faffing and putting it back together again for free had taken its toll that day.

We're all human, and because they ARE such a great workshop, to me, the relationship is actually more important than the car.

[Citroënbender]

Just for the curious and for reference, the side-to-side cable is the blue headed one, and that's closest to the left hand rear in the engine bay. 

[ugame]

Just for the curious and for reference, the side-to-side cable is the blue headed one, and that's closest to the left hand rear in the engine bay.

Thanks mate that DOES help
Always nice to know what to look for.

Ok so see pic. You can clearly see both nice new cables (GB end) and from the post quoted above, the side/side is the blue cable end.

So (And I'm not touching it), how would one "adjust" this cable?

My intuition tells me that perhaps the yellow clip pulls off and allows the fitting to slide up and down? And then locked back into place?
Or is it something else?

Or can this type NOT be adjusted?

Searching the interwebs all I get is posts saying there is no adjustment, which would mean the workshop were right about that part.
one eg
https://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-147-156-andamp-gt/197146-147-gear-change-problems.html

[johnl]

My original cable ends were much simpler than that one, without the rectangular yellow 'button' and the enlarged part of the housing surrounding it. Mine were not adjustable, and I can only speculate that the reason for your cable ends being more complex is to provide a length adjustment (why the extra complexity if the less complex design works, as long as adjustment is not considered necessary?).

I would expect that pressing the yellow button (or otherwise fiddling with it) is more than likely to 'release' the cable end from it's grip on the rod, and allow it to be moved. Having said that...

Regards,
John.

[Cool Jesus]

Ok so see pic. You can clearly see both nice new cables (GB end) and from the post quoted above, the side/side is the blue cable end.

So (And I'm not touching it), how would one "adjust" this cable?

Yes that's the one mate. The 147 doesn't normally have an adjustment and I think this revision of cable is new. My 159 had a latching mechanism at the gearstick end. You unlock the GB end cable adjustment and then you lock the stick in its neutral spot. Then close the GB cable end adjustment to set the stick's upright position. I don't remember performing an adjustment on my 147, it seemed to be spot on when I changed the cables which match your photo. I'm guessing that, if you unlock that yellow clip to allow the GB cable end to slide in length. You then go back to your stick, set it at the right spot for yourself, then lock the adjustment clip in place.

One minor point though. The other cable is missing its counter weight? Your old cables would have had it and it needs to be removed and swapped over. Its 2 screws and 2 halves that encapsulate the other cable end. Its not terminal to the install. I believe its to give the stick some feel and remove some vibration maybe? (I stand to be corrected) I don't have it on mine due to the counter weight fouling on the sport shifter I have installed. No real side effects to speak of as yet...

And yes, do stay with your guy, if your happy with their work then that's what counts. I'd be careful about saying anything to them from what's been said here. If you do enquire, just make it come from you not a forum. Don't want you to ruin any good relations you have with them. After all we are almost all, arm chair mechanics posting on here, but we do have your (and our Alfa's) best interests at heart.

[Citroënbender]

Never had to adjust it, but the system is pretty universal.

The red lock tab must be disengaged from the blue body where it pushes in by sliding back, then the yellow clip can be pulled/prised outwards, the cable length adjusted within its limits (it should be captive and just slide maybe 10-15mm) and the process reversed with due attention to the locking tab. 

[ugame]

Thanks again and yes no way I'm going I with "but the forum says..."

The real purpose of the original post was to establish whether or not these cables stretch as suggested.

If they don't, and if the cables are not adjustable, that really does leave us with "why would the lever be sitting to the left?"

[bazzbazz]

I posted earlier -

"There is a small bracket that clips on to both cables just forward of where they clip onto the gear stick, if this is not fitted onto both cables properly it will also cause a similar effect."

If this clip on bracket is not fitted it could be a possible cause, and it does not come with the new cables as far as i know.

[Citroënbender]

Nominal date of the revised shift cables, is January 15th, 2004.

[ugame]

Bazz, yep noted. The only way I broached this was to ask if everything had been installed correctly through all the clips. Hard to ask the question direct without saying "but this guy on a forum said...."

Citreon, I think we posted at the same time. When I pop in next I'll ask that question.

I assume they know and perhaps what they meant was that it was adjusted as far as it can go.

I'll ask to see a new cable off the shelf so we can play with it at the counter.

I'll also ask to see a new shifter so he can show me "how" they "fixed" it.

That's all i can do really.

[bazzbazz]

Bazz, yep noted. The only way I broached this was to ask if everything had been installed correctly through all the clips. Hard to ask the question direct without saying "but this guy on a forum said...."

One of my clients who I get on very well with booked me in to fix his clutch pedal on his 156, when I arrived at the door his wife who is a ER Nurse cried out "The Mechanic's here."

I replied, "MECHANIC! My good woman I am a highly trained & qualified Alfa Romeo diagnostic & service specialist, if I am nothing more than a Mechanic you are nothing more than a bed pan cleaner!"

My good friend looked at me with a terrified look and just screamed "RUN!"

[Cool Jesus]

I wouldn't sweat on it any further. If its fixed then happy days. As Bazz mentioned, it needs those locking tabs, if the cables are loose gear changes will be near impossible. I had one spring loose and disappear somewhere within the engine bay. Half a day of search, swearing and tearing things apart I finally found the little bastard.

The two issues I had over the years with my 147 gear stick was initially the gear lever housing was kaput and the lever swung around like a ladle in a big soup pot. New housing sorted that.
Next was 2nd and reverse gears wear slowly becoming harder to engage. Initially I thought gearbox was done for after finding metal swath in the outer casing (issue when 4th isnt able to be engaged} and visible damage to some teeth through the fill hole. Then 4th was playing up again, but no swathe. I then twigged and had a second assistant change gears while I looked at gearbox end and found the sheathing had come apart from the metal stop that locks onto gearbox. New cables and the TS was back in business. Prick of a job too without a hoist, the whole housing needs to come out from under the car and of course everything that's in the way.

Its steel cable that would break before stretching. The ancillary parts would fail IMO before the cable though. Pieces are crimped, plastics, plastic sheathing and ball joints etc, it has a life span. anyhow, trying to find some of my photos with no luck  yet