air conditioner for 105

[1750GTV]

Found a couple of pictures from the alfabb board.
This is an installation on a standard twin cam. If the compressor goes in a different spot on the twin spark, then it's anyones guess if it will fit.
The interior doesn't look too bad.
Chris

[Ash Gordon]

My car had the air unit under the dash / glove box . and battery had been moved to the boot ( where it is still situated ) to make room for the compressor.  To be honest the cooling factor of the unit wasn't great, It may have just been out of gas . You might as well rolll down the window or

If you open both windows you've got a split system!

I could look for the unit if you are interested, but I think it may have been chucked out.

[1750GT]

I had a chat to Marinello motors about aircon in my 17fidy because my heater needed a new motor and I thought I would consider it before I went and got the heater fixed. I got a similar solution suggested, with battery moved to the boot, but when I considered loss of power, the potential additional issues you potentially create with the cars cooling system, the amount of times I would use it versus the window and putting the heater on cold flow thru (which works well on hot days up to about 28 - 30 degrees unless theres a northerly hot wind) and importantly the amount of additional stress on the engine block and the holes in the fire wall/body work, I decided not to muck around with my 17fidy and enjoy it as is.


1750GT

[1750GTV]

The only photo I could find an under dash installation in a 105 Coupe.
Think I might stick to the open 1/4 windows.
Chris

[1750GT]

1750GTV, looks like a useless unit for the driver and the rear seat passengers; but it reminds me of some great memories of a similar unit I had in my ford RS2000 many moons ago when I was alot younger.

It was a late 70's model in burnt orange and a real chick magnate. Anyway the car came fully loaded from the UK except it had no aircon and Ford Aus would fit a huge long unit under the glove box, similar to the one in the 105 except longer. Whilst it didn't direct airflow directly to the driver it was a beast of a unit for one reason and one reason alone! It was great for when the women, with short skirts sat in the passenger seat on a hot day and of course I would do the right thing and turn on the aircon, a great drive and a great distraction when I had a looker in the passenger seat! skirt flowing wanderingly with the airflow from the aircon.

Ah, the joys of under dash aircon, don't really know why I got rid of that car?

1750GT

[Ash Gordon]

1750GTV, looks like a useless unit for the driver and the rear seat passengers;

How often do you have rear seat passengers in a 105  ?  I think I have only punished people twice by squeezing them in the back, needless to say they haven't been in the back seat since ! 

[njh1964]

Hi Dan,

As you and I have previously discussed offline, I'm also in the process of dropping a Twin Spark into a 105. Like you, I'd also like to install air con into my car... particularly after the summer we just had in Melbourne.

At the moment, I'm looking at one of those combined heater/air con units that a few companies manufacture in the US for the custom street/hotrod market over there. The dimensions of these units (see attached diagram) are typically pretty compact... hopefully compact enough to be installed up inside the dash of a 105 Alfa in place of the standard Alfa heater unit.

I'm thinking it shouldn't be too difficult to plumb the heater/air con unit into the existing Alfa dash vents, and it may even be possible to rig something up to re-use the existing Alfa fresh air inlet mechanism.

Apart from that, relocating the Alfa 75 air con compressor from down low on the driver's side to up high on the passenger side (ie in place of the Alfa 75 power steering compressor) should not be too difficult with some creative bracketry and relocation of the battery into the boot... famous last words, perhaps.

Cheers,


Nick

[cjheath]

I'm currently in the process of installing a twin spark out of a 75 into a 64 Sprint GT and was wondering if anyone had seen a conversion of a twin spark into a 105 coupe that retained the 75's Air Con equipment? Does it fit or is it mission impossible?

I have a TS in my (damaged) 1969 GTV, no a/c, but with the TS you already have a problem of where to put an air box. Currently my car just uses a foam filter sock, and though it may be possible to find an airbox that can be fitted, it's a small space. Also the space for the radiator overflow tank is doubled up with the washer bottle, which is an awkward arrangement. The point is, if you want to fit a/c too, something's got to go elsewhere.

[joehorvath]

Not sure if it will fit but you get an AC under dash blower unit from a later model US Spider to go under the dash inplace of the regular blower? Spiders from the 80's often had air fitted and some of these are now being dismantled. Try De Noya Trading post Ebay shop. I know he has some & will post to Australia if you ask him nicely.

[airconcando]

Hi Folks - I drove a 105 Junior with 2L for twenty years, and eventually put air con in it.  Being an Alfa owner I'm not a "yu cant do that person".  I used an under dash unit in the middle, but a better way is to get a series3 spider heater/aircon or convert an Alfetta type.  I have converted a Guiletta unit since the inlet vent on the top is exactly the same shape as the air inlet in a 105, just the wrong way round.  With some inventive rejigging (reverse it) the angle matches the 105 hole perfectly. http://www.philipstorr.id.au/spider/trunk.htm
Alfetta's position of the compressor is not good, it splits the top of the head oil galleys.  With the 75TS Alfa choose the correct position, no stress on the cylinder head and on the opposite side to the exhaust so the air con hoses are away from that heat.  The 75TS uses a Sanden 505, now numbered a SD5.  In my installation I used an SD7.  ebay for "Sanden air con".  I mounted my compressor bottom front right same spot as a TS on a 105 2L using a US Spider 115 2L front engine section and US spider water pump.  Essentially I placed the compressor where the spica mechanical pump normally goes.  Lloyd Clonan of START in SA and myself designed a bracket which is basically a heavy steel plate that fits between the RHS engine bracket and extends all the way to the front of the engine, fitting flush with the engine block and the front timing chain housing since this is possible by using that front metal work from a US spica engine.  The US spica water pump elevates the lower radiator hose away from the compressor belt.  Tension is achieved by adjusting the position of the compressor, hinging on the lower mount points.  We designed the mounting lugs so that the bracket could take either an SD5 or SD7 sanden.  Lloyd may be able to supply a bracket if requested.

[airconcando]

For the condensor at the front the unit from an Alfetta or 75 TS is what I used, it is a two row, and the same dimension as a 105 series 2 radiator.  I mounted it as far forward as possible, with a Davies Craig fan attached to it between it and the radiator and sucking air through it.  To have some distance between condensor and radiator means the Hi/Lo safety switch will not operate when the heat from the radiator permeates through to the condensor.  I had to angle the radiator back at a bit of a slant to allow for the mid mounted fan.  I found use of the original radiator plastic shround to be critical in conjunction with the water pump driven fan.  The end result was a car I could drive to work on the hotest of days, and survive.  I consider the issue of air conditioning to be a safety issue, not something to be derided.  It gets hot in Adelaide.  I don't own the Junior anymore but have recovered the bracket from the new owner.  He earnestly informed me that it did not fit, which is nosense since it was fitted to the car when he bought it.
This weekend I removed a TS engine from a wreck.  I think looking at the TS setup, that the compressor might be sitting about half an inch futher out than Lloyds and my custom bracket which will be critical.  There was maybe half an inch clearance between the compressor and the body.  Now that I have a TS engine to look at, if people want I will find my 115 SD5/7 bracket and compare the two, since I know mine fits.  Another point is that an electric fuel pump needed to be used, since the spica cam chain housing has no provision for a mechanical pump.  I have thought to discuss with Lloyd how difficult it might be to adapt our bracket design to the 105 cam chain housing, albeit using a US spica type pump to clear the compressor belt and electric fuel pump.
Cheers for now, Mark Barrington.

[airconcando]

I just carefully read all the posts on this topic and just remembered yet another aspect to my air conditioning in a 105 saga.  I had a three row radiator, 17 fins per inch made, which is basically a reasonably high spec radiator.  The original 105 radiator is very good, I just think the new one I had made was a bit better, and it was necessary to keep the engine at the proper temperature.  I also arranged a thermostat to activate the electric fan to cut in when the engine temperature became highish.  Another quandry was whether or not to operate the fan constantly when the air conditioning was on. or to just have it cut in when the compressor was on.  The later choice often meant the air con gas never was condensed properly, so it is probably best to have it running constantly when the air conditioner is operating. There were numbers of iterations of the installation, and I have only detailed the successful points in the previous two emails.  It is because the knowledge that I gained in the exercise was hard won that I have felt it important to actually list all that I can recall about what it took to get the system to work and the car to not overheat.

[airconcando]

Image of a MKIV under dash unit in the centre of a Junior.  Also the engine bay, but unfortunately I have no shots of the compressor area.  Note the padding in front of the radiator, it is slanted back a bit, and also the adjustable thermofan switch with knob on the left of the radiator.  These are the only evidence from this view of the air conditioning installation.

[airconcando]

The under dash unit.  As I suggested in a previous post, an Alfetta / Guilietta unit would be better, especially with a centre console in place.

[Dan H]

Thanks all

There seem to be a few aftermarket air-con systems that could fit underneath/behind the dash and use the existing vents.  A combined heater/air con unit could replace the existing Alfa heater.  There is a place in Qld that Nick H put me onto called Speedy Air Spares (they have a website) who could provide pretty much everything you need, brand new, for around $1000.  There is also a place called Vintage Air out of the US that makes systems where the controls for the units operate electronic servos - pretty much the same as modern vehicles but they are a bit pricier.

Dan