GTV 116 supercharged NORD

[Midda Samid]

I haven't found the required M62 charger yet.. The model I am after seems a rarity in Aus, so I am looking OS.. and haven't had a chance to do anything else car related either. The M45 system is all still installed, so i will play with that in the meantime.. I am still perplexed by the boost figure differences from the calc's and the actual measured PSI, so will play with the setup and see if i can't find some boost bleeding off somewhere.. The charger is remarkably noisy, so maybe I have got a boost leak at the charger outlet.. worth playing around with.. 7psi is plenty fun..

I have other misfire issues i need to sort too, so just need to get refocussed and leave my conscience at the shed door.. It's been difficult starting the thing without thinkng I am drowning out my neighbourhood's ability to think.. it's loud.. and my direct neighbour is one of our trusted protectors.. last thing I need is to upset him.

[Midda Samid]

not sure anyone is interested, but hell, i have to tell someone(or something)..

Found some boost leaks with the ole "soapy water test" on the charger outlet manifold and the throttle body to plenum. There is a pinhole in my masterful welding in the charger outlet aswell..

while it is apart for repairs and improved gasket sealing, I used the opportunity to take the plenum and the inlet manifold off the engine to repair a weeping water leak.. what I found was that the injector angle in the inlet runners is focussing it's spray at the gasket join between the alfa inlet manifold and the plenum flange and over the 6 years it's been installed it's pushed fuel almost to the outside of the silicon formagasket that I was using... works out to be about 48 degrees from horizontal, so I have decided to redesign the inlet runners on the plenum to try to improve the injector angle and keep the fuel off the opposite wall of the inlet tract especially at low rpm(low flow).. I figure the airflow losses of curved inlet runners is a better option than poorly atomised fuel.. with a curve of about 34 degrees at a 75mm radius in the runner I can aim the injector at the valve head.. 

any opinions on curved inlet runners are welcome..

[Duk]

I think you're reading way too much into this 'curved runner = flow loss' thing. There would be more compromise in your plenum chamber design than that.

As you've mentioned, poor injector angle will probably be more of an issue.

Depending on how much room you have would determine which way you would curve the runners.
If you have the room to add a slight curve to each runner and that directs the plenum down towards the sump, then you could (as I mentioned on AlfaBB) put the injector at the outside of the bend radius and get a better spray angle.
If you have to add bends to the runners so that the plenum chamber is raised towards the bonnet, I'd then mount the injectors underneath each runner, again at the outside bend radius.

[Midda Samid]

Thanks Duk, i have the space to curve down toward the sump.. It only requires a slight curve to get the injector 9 degrees above horizontal and shooting straight at the valve.. I am using 44mm runner inside diametre with 45mm of straight runner out of the plenum into 57mm of curved runner(outside radius measure) giving me a 34degree turn at a 75mm radius. The injector boss will be welded on the outside radius next to the join between the straight and the curved runner.. Total runner length including the head and Alfa manifold will be about 180mm average(with the current design). Runner to Alfa manifold is port matched, but apart from that, porting is standard as are valves.

I am planning on increasing the volume of the plenum by half to assist with piping from the intercooler, but have no idea what it will do to performance.. same for runner length, it is more designed for space constraints rather than function..

Plenum is currently about 1 litre and the runners currently add up to 0.56 litres. New design will reduce runner volume, but increase plenum volume.

And I always read too much into everything. 

[Midda Samid]

ok, I am back..

Curved runner modification completed and all of the original plan with custom airbox, cold air intake and supercharger resonator installed.

So, airbox is a jaguar X300 with the top cut off and fibreglassed to fit under the contour of the alfetta bonnet. Resonator is from a '99 C230 mercedes, and is fitted behind the exhaust manifold against the firewall.. it's tight. I have heat wrapped the number 4 exhaust primary, and before anyone says it will crack, well, that's too bad. if it does, when it does I will replace it.. the clearances to the resonator are about 5mm, so i figure a cracked manifold is better than an engine compartment fire.

Curved runner mod was simply that.. weld curved runners in between the flange and the plenum. I had the flange face machined and o-rings machined aswell an o-ring for the throttle body face.

I have reinstalled the heater and therefore had to find a new hole for my computer temp sender(as I was using the manifold to heater core outlet) .. i had a boss welded into the thermostat housing. Thermostat is reinstalled and have twin thermo's. 1 x 12inch push fan and 1 x 10inch pull fan. I managed to get the original overflow bottle in there too.. happy about that.. it's old and yellow, but it's meant to be there. Took some shuffling of the IAC and fuel pressure reg and oil catch can, but worth the pain.

Intercooler remains the same 550x145x65 and so far has proven capable.

Oil cooler hasn't been installed yet.. the one I have won't fit infront of the passenger wheel where I want it, so might have to source another.

And with such a full engine compartment now, I haven't space for a windscreen washer bottle, so need a solution there. maybe a soft bag type like the fiats used.. or mount one in the nose behind headlights.?? more thought on that.

Other than that, apart from some clean up of welding and fixing some pinholes(I can't weld) and giving everything a much needed coat of paint to beat the brown rust look, nothing else has changed.. pic's attached.

I am waiting for some silicon to go off before I can test run it. I am hoping for quieter operation and better control of cooling..

Inlet mod's might see transition from closed to open throttle seem smoother.. I won't be tuning it for a while, so realistically won't be bleating about power gains or tuning control anytime soon.. and besides, I am still well below my target of 10psi(hitting around 7psi), so need a new charger before I waste money on tuning..

Oh, car got new carpet and underlay while I was waiting for parts... charcoal.. nice. A tip if you are thinking of using a moulded carpet supplier - when they form the carpet, while it is being pressed they trim the edges.. I requested they not trim so I could fit the carpet at home and trim myself.. much better outcome.. usually the carpets come up a bit short at the kick panels, firewall, rear seat and door trim plates.. 

[Mike]

Yeehah!  Good work 'ol chap.  nothing more pleasing that doing thngs yourself...you may not be able to weld, but at least you have a crack, you will only get better!

[Midda Samid]

Hi Mike, yeah, not always pretty, but I can boast it was all done in an under tooled shed in middle suburbia with the kids in bed.. haha. man, when you start adding extras to an alfetta engine bay, the space quickly disappears.. and the cuts and scratches start appearing on the backs of hands and forearms.. tight

I am ready to turn the key but am afraid to for the looming disappointment of a supercharger that can be heard 3 suburbs away.. if after all this it is stll noisy, i shan't yet admit defeat(**NEVER**).. I'll blame the second hand charger and source a refurbed replacement.. larger of course(when I get another job to pay for it).. that's all that talk of the m62 from the earlier c230.. new brackets required for that though, so won't be immediately.. Brisbane calls me.. actually, reminds me.. i need to email you.

On fitting the final resonator to charger piping I have found I run awfully close to No.3 primary also, so need to wrap that too.. that should delay my turn key enough for me to come to grips with the pain of 100's of hours spent and no result.. booo.. haha

[Mike]

I don't want to say it, but that intake?  is going to hit the exhaust on engine rock.  Maybe drop the dia of piping and mount a stainless sheet heat sheild to the extractors to get the air gap, then wrap the pipe....could wrap the manifold as well in the fibreglass wrapping you can get from raceshops....it makes a decent difference and is cheaper than ceramic coating.

[MD]

The insulated cast manifolds are not likely to crack. They will definitely, positively and without question crack. You need a solution NOW for that eventuallity which may take from weeks to months but it will be there.

Once that happens, you will have the added potential problem of dangerous carbon monoxides getting past the usual holes in the firewall and  entering your cabin. Don't forget that carbon monoxide is an odourless and toxic gas. Not something you want to play Russian Roullete with.

Either make some headers to do the job or install an insulation barrier in sheet form available from Repco that will shield your heat sensitive parts but allow the majority of the heat in the manifold to be released. Forget about the convection heat and concentrate on the radiant heat which is the most efficient form of heat transfer and that is what you need to block.

This is the type of material you need : http://www.aclperformance.com.au/prod_heatshield.htm

[Midda Samid]

thanks for the heatsield link.. looks good.. I expect the manifold to complain about beng wrapped, but i also expect an audible change to the engine bay before the levels of CO get to "life threatening".. new manifold is not an option.. $$$.. my solution for a cracked manifold at this stage is the spare one I have sitting in the shed.. and on a lighter note, any carbon monoxide coming out of my alfa has an odour.. trust me.. it's a smokey bbq of cheap oil and too much fuel with a hint of ...sniiiifff... sausages? no, must be some of my torn flesh and blood burning off all the sharp bits..

Mike, yep, it's close.. majority of the piping is fixed with the engine, so engine rock won't alter the clearances(much). at this stage I am only wrapping sections of the manifold rather than the entire tube flange to flange(see pic, it shows no4 wrapped in that fibreglass tape).. heat shield like MD has sent through looks the bizness.. next step is pricing it.. i bet it isn't cheap.. at this stage i am running a budget build, so cost adders are just opportunities for the wife to remind me how little money we have..

I still haven't started it.. what a wimp

[Mike]

You can buy the stuff Mike is talking about from ACL, pretty sure it is made in Qlnd.  I have it on my car and bought 2 sheets.  The sheets are about 250*700 from memory.  70 dollars per sheet is what I recal, and it is very good stuff.  Just be very carefull when cutting it, it has ceramic fibre or something in side it (and from memory).  What ever it was,m I recall thinking it was mask and carefull cleanuff stuff not to be triffled with.
I also have spare factory manfidolds kicking around which you will be welcome to.  MD makes a good point with them, better not to wrap them.

[Midda Samid]

started it today.. it's noisy.. made no difference adding the resonator and the airbox and cold air intake.. the noise is coming directly from the front end of the charger.. I have to assume the charger is stuffed and will have to consider a replacement.. I had an elec miss or ignition breakdown or something too, so have to find that..

I wrapped 100mm of the no.3 primary where it passes the inlet hoses and the no.4 primary is maybe 200mm wrapped..

how disappointing.!

[scott.venables]

I wouldn't give up on the supercharger.  There's a chance it's the bearings and it just needs a rebuild.

I've sent you a PM

Cheers, Scott

[Mike]

Assume you have checked the oil level in the charger!  I am sure you have.

Elec miss - make sure all leads are pushed down inside their sheaths.  Try a nice clean set of plugs.  Check earths.

Chin up.

[Midda Samid]

Thanks for the positivity lads.. new task is to find a rebuild kit.. well done.

Mike, your signature thing doesn't mention the alfetta sedan..? do you still have it?